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US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

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Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#331

Post by amiga386 »

rlpb wrote: post #327
amiga386 wrote: post #323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a motte-and-bailey argument. The government set out to reduce consumption of high-sugar drinks. They had choices on how to do that e.g. they could've targetted demand. They chose to target supply with a "sin tax". Private companies then, for no reason whatsoever, of their own free will, decided to eliminate high-sugar drink options. They would not have done so had the government not imposed the tax. If you the…

> I still drink as much as I normally do, which is about 12 litres a year; I am well under the intended beneficiary of this war on sugar, the sort of people who drink >100 litres a year… It sounds like Irn-Bru was only viable _because_ of the sort of people who drink >100 litres a year. You were benefitting from that viability thanks to the very people you admit were being targeted by the tax. If they had stopped the…

That's a very good argument!

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#332

Post by leptons »

ranger_danger wrote: post #311
leptons wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A part costs what a part costs, and the consumer is always going to be the one who pay for that. If tariffs raise the price of the part, then the consumer pays more for the product the part is used in. The cost of the part goes up (because tariffs), the price of the product goes up too. It's really that simple. No "importer" is going to eat the cost of the tariffs, and it is ridiculous that anyone would think that.

> No "importer" is going to eat the cost of the tariffs, and it is ridiculous that anyone would think that. I know several who do exactly that.

I'm going to call bullshit on that. They likely had stock on-hand that they purchased before the tariffs.

I have a hardware startup (parts imported from China, assembled on-shore), and I guarantee you that my customers are paying for every cent of the tariffs that make my product cost ~30% to 100% more (depending on the whims of an imbecile). No way am I paying it. I can't afford it. The parts cost what they cost, and there simply is no alternative part that can be purchased locally. If my customers can't swallow the extra cost, then I have less customers, which hurts my small business. If you were my customer, you would be paying for the tariffs.

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#333

Post by bobthepanda »

Aloisius wrote: post #278
bobthepanda wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that the tariffs are so broad in ways that don’t help US industry; and there are few supply chains wholly within the US so you end up hurting US manufacturing as well. It doesn’t really make sense, for example, that we slapped tariffs on Madagascar, when the primary reason we run a trade deficit with them is that they grow vanilla which cannot be grown in the US.

Several species of vanilla are indigenous to Puerto Rico. Indeed, Puerto Rico used to be the ninth largest vanilla producer in the world. Vanilla will happily grow in parts of Florida and the USVI as well.

Given the current discourse around recent events involving Puerto Rico I highly doubt encouraging things there is the intended point of anything.

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#334

Post by FuriouslyAdrift »

bubblewand wrote: post #330
FuriouslyAdrift wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Manufacturing is booming in the Midwest which is the region we service. They have more business, we have more business.

Given the sheer volume of cheap stuff that had been coming straight from China, and the end of de minimus, my first guess would be the majority of this is Chinese and other foreign goods that are now being imported in bulk to minimize duties and costs of handling paperwork, then distributed state-side. Lots of new business (and resulting extra costs to consumers) in logistics, without as much of an increase on the ma…

our main customers are industrial manufacturers (the midwest is the heart of manufacturing and warehousing for the US)

some of our clients are Tesla, Toyota, Thyssenkrup, Caterpillar, Amazon, Rolls Royce Allison, Cummins.

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#335

Post by bubblewand »

FuriouslyAdrift wrote: post #334
bubblewand wrote: post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the sheer volume of cheap stuff that had been coming straight from China, and the end of de minimus, my first guess would be the majority of this is Chinese and other foreign goods that are now being imported in bulk to minimize duties and costs of handling paperwork, then distributed state-side. Lots of new business (and resulting extra costs to consumers) in logistics, without as much of an increase on the ma…

our main customers are industrial manufacturers (the midwest is the heart of manufacturing and warehousing for the US) some of our clients are Tesla, Toyota, Thyssenkrup, Caterpillar, Amazon, Rolls Royce Allison, Cummins.

Ah, mostly big, durable stuff. Interesting, that’s a very different sort of thing than the cheap consumer goods I had in mind.

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#336

Post by irishcoffee »

steveBK123 wrote: post #148
irishcoffee wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You know what all the poor people are bitching about right now? Power bills.

Which is why pushback against datacenter builds has begun..

Better stage a protest so the prices change. The pushback is real..

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#337

Post by sejje »

tastyfreeze wrote: post #308
sejje wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More than half the country still doesn't pay any (income) tax.

That is a bit of a lie. Getting a refund does not mean you didn't pay. Even getting more back than you actually paid does not mean you didn't pay. Money is taken from every paycheck. When you file your taxes the IRS decides what you get back.

Disagree, I think my wording was fine. But okay, 50% of Americans don't contribute to the country with income tax. They are leeching their services from those of us who do.

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#338

Post by jemmyw »

amiga386 wrote: post #323
jemmyw wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But the government didn't make the drink awful. They only set the tax. Your position is that you'd have paid more anyway but now tis not an option. That seems like a business decision. Maybe the old version has so much sugar it was untenable with the tax... how sugary was it?

That's a motte-and-bailey argument. The government set out to reduce consumption of high-sugar drinks. They had choices on how to do that e.g. they could've targetted demand. They chose to target supply with a "sin tax". Private companies then, for no reason whatsoever, of their own free will, decided to eliminate high-sugar drink options. They would not have done so had the government not imposed the tax. If you the…

> they could've targetted demand. They chose to target supply with a "sin tax".

I think you've got that back to front. A higher price reduces demand. There is still the capability to supply, but the demand is no longer there.

Re: US businesses and consumers pay 90% of tariff costs, New York Fed says

#339

Post by snfour »

adocomplete wrote: post #73
ApolloFortyNine wrote: post #57

I think blanket tariffs are dumb don't get me wrong. But tariffs have been used in the car industry for decades. If you got rid of them completely within 5 years the American car companies would be closing plants. The whole reason Japanese auto manufacturers build plants in the US was to avoid tariffs. Shipping costs are actually incredibly minimal for a vehicle. So in my opinion, we've seen where they can work. If y…

Don't American cars have some of the lowest levels of reliability? I'm not super educated on all the happenings in the car industry globally, but I've seen a few videos of Chinese EVs that put anything Ford, GM or other US brands have put out to absolute shame.

hi
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