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Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

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Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#331

Post by saghm »

redhale wrote: post #319
saghm wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OP's article didn't explicitly state requiring, but it did claim make the claim that I'm objectively worse at my job by working remotely than I am in person: > Remote work eliminates a lot of problems with office work: commutes, inefficient use of real estate, and land value distortion. But software development is better when you breathe the same air as the folks you work with. Even with a camera-on policy, video cal…

I see your point. But I guess this is a good example of default assumptions. When I read a personal blog, unless I see words like "objectively", or see explicit arguments stating that others should/must do X, I by default read it as the author expressing their personal opinion on X. But I can see it the other way too. I think it could be solved by the author using an "I" framing as they did in every other section.

> I think it could be solved by the author using an "I" framing as they did in every other section

Yeah, this is probably what really confused me most about it. The tone felt remarkably different in that section than the others, and when it's also the topic that at least to me seems the most controversial, I can't help but wonder if it's representative in some way. It's not at all uncommon for people to dig in their heels more when presented with disagreement, so it's hard for me not to be concerned that the only reason this section is phrased differently is that this is the topic where they've received the most pushback on, which would be exactly what I'd expect even before accounting for the actual phrasing of their opinion.

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#332

Post by saghm »

ryanackley wrote: post #325
saghm wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The onus should not be on the communicator to qualify every statement of opinion. This is tedious and unreasonable. I fundamentally disagree with this. In my experience, it's in pretty much in possible for people to perfectly understand intent without a certain amount of effort from both the communicator to express it clearly and the listener to understand it. In practice, I don't think there's a good chance of suc…

This argument over the semantics of how to express an opinion feels like a proxy for people who strongly disagree with him on remote work seeking an outlet. I say that because you (and everyone else who seems upset) clearly understand it's just his opinion. Therefore, why are you offended by his intent? Whatever his intent might be, I think it's irrelevant. It's simply a strongly held opinion.

> I say that because you (and everyone else who seems upset) clearly understand it's just his opinion.

I genuinely don't understand whether it's the case or not, and I've tried to be clear about that. I am not able to tell whether it's their opinion or if they actually feel like they're objective facts; both are plausible to me, and I'm arguing that if they want people to understand which they mean, they need to be more specific. Otherwise, people will draw conclusions that may not align with their intent, and that's something they could avoid if they put more care into how they expressed it.

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#333

Post by fluoridation »

saghm wrote: post #311
fluoridation wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that any more dehumanizing than just working a job in general?

Not all jobs are equally dehumanizing, and not everyone finds the same things equally dehumanizing, especially in the context of what one's job is described as is part of the overall experience. If I'm hired with the expectation of writing software, I don't want to be expected to run out and get coffee for my coworkers so that they can write software better. That doesn't mean that I think everyone will find going on…

I really think those are bad examples. I don't see how someone making what you consider to be an unreasonable request can make one feel dehumanized. Insulted or demeaned? Maybe, sure. But dehumanized? What does that say about your opinion of people who do do coffee runs or who like to work in offices? Nevertheless, I'll roll with it.

I would say it comes down to common practices. Commonly, engineers don't do coffee runs. Commonly, office jobs have always been done in an office, and this status quo has only changed fairly recently (let's say in the last 20 years). History could have played out such that it became common practice for coffee run duty to cycle over everyone in the office, regardless of role, in which case asking you to do it would have been perfectly reasonable, and someone would be right to ask what makes you so special than you can't do something everyone else does. Likewise for remote work. Some places allow it, some don't, and some may transition from one to the other. Since this is known to be the case (no one will believe you if you try to feign ignorance on this), it is reasonable to require to come to the office, no matter how many years you've been doing remote work.

>having expectations change without my consent (e.g. being told after multiple years working remotely that I need to start going into an office or "voluntarily" leave).

When expectations change unilaterally, that usually calls for a renegotiation. The correct response to "we want you to start coming to the office every day" is "okay, then I want $x more every year to cover my additional expenses". Now, it could be that either or neither party is willing to negotiate on such terms, or even that they do negotiate but no consensus is reached, in which case you just have to dissolve the business relationship. What else can you do?

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#334

Post by flir »

sailfast wrote: post #303
flir wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Uh.... Caught me red handed. Ok, gonna go read it. (Hmm. The author says "Follow Scrum, Lean / Kanban, or eXtreme Programming to the letter, and let your team focus on the product." I disagree - quite vehmently. I guess that's obvious, given that I'm calling out the various capital-A agile methodoliges, and the parasitical industry around them, as harmful/bloated/mostly pointless. But how did you figure out I hadn't…

The author pretty clearly states that Agile works well and we should stick to it without deviating too much with our own processes. Your point was related to the parent post but contradicting the article and didn’t acknowledge the contradiction or why your opinion about Agile might be more correct than the author - that’s basically it. The industry around it makes total sense - often bloated and misusing terms, but t…

Makes sense, fair enough.

> as a starting point

Even you disagree with the author :) But yeah, a team with the power to change its own processes, rather than have Agile imposed on it, isn't a team that's cargo-culting an Agile Brand).

(Last couple of months I've been introduced to "retrospective story points"; we're supposed to fill in how many points the ticket actually took after we've done it. I haven't yet found the words to express how pointless I think this is).

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#335

Post by diordiderot »

venturecruelty wrote: post #328
TRiG_Ireland wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a very strange (and very emotional) take. I find it easier to focus with some other people around me, so long as they're being quiet. An office (or a library) is easier to work in than my house. I also really like the idea of separation between my home and my workplace. If I was rich and had room in my house for a separate office I could close the door on when the workday was over, perhaps I'd feel differentl…

Nobody is stopping you from spending time breathing the same stale, rhinovirus-ridden air as other people. What people take umbrage with is the idea that the rest of us should be forced into propping up the commercial rental market as well.

Dude chill. It's an air-conditioned room with desks and a coffee machine, not a cotton field.

Some people like having an office.

I could call someone like you a hyper dramatic agoraphobic socially inept recluse over a simple posted opinion but that wouldn't be kind,fair, or mature

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#336

Post by s1mplicissimus »

throwaway277432 wrote: post #213
QuercusMax wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got a minor reprimand in a performed review for having a slightly heated conversation in a public channel. In the past that company had been very open about communicating about negative stuff (our CEO emailed the entire company when he visited one of the hardware labs that was a mess), but the upper management started tamping down on anything negative, and one of the things that suffered was any sort of honest comm…

I got a major reprimand because I answered too many questions posted in the public channel. All in my area of expertise, mostly after hours. At first they said it was "great". But it soon turned sour and resulted in "it seems like you spend too much time answering questions", and I should "focus" and "free up" that time to work on my assigned tasks. Well, I don't answer anything anymore. In fact nobody does. It used…

But now the layer of management above you can justify organizing meetings to "get aligned" and "communicate". Structurally, i see how it happens

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#337

Post by lovich »

sailfast wrote: post #308
im3w1l wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe I'm a bit unfair to you but to me your comment basically reads as wishing employees would be good little cogs in your machinery rather than people. Like making friends is natural human behavior. Forming friend groups is natural human behavior. It's not nice to disrupt this except that of course everyone has to be able to work together when needed.

Making friends is great. Talking about work with friends is good and healthy. Moving all of your work related chats off-platform so you can “say whatever you want” about work and eventually making it into a defacto team chat is what I’m talking about here. This isn’t chatting with friends, this is creating team divisions and huge gaps in context for the rest of your team. This approach is being a poor colleague in my…

You can’t do both things. Humans want to engage in certain kinds of conversation that companies try to prevent happening.

Sometimes you just want to vent and call your boss a fuckhead and it only takes one time in a persons life to see HR punishing/firing/admonishing someone for conduct on company communication channels that would have been perfectly fine in any other setting, for that person to never trust in the “company culture”

There is no environment where messy human beings fit into the perfect set of rules and behavior that companies demand

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#338

Post by dwoldrich »

inetknght wrote: post #268

> Remote Work Sucks > Remote work eliminates a lot of problems with office work: commutes, inefficient use of real estate, and land value distortion. But software development is better when you breathe the same air as the folks you work with. Even with a camera-on policy, video calls are a low-bandwidth medium. You lose ambient awareness of coworkers’ problems, and asking for help is a bigger burden. Pair programming…

Out of sight, out of mind.

When I was a remote worker (forced to be so during extended lockdown insanity in my state), I worried constantly about how I was seen by coworkers and my manager.

I felt very vulnerable to (and fell prey to) RIF's like I had never experienced in my whole corporate career stretching back to the 90's.

Slack is no replacement for confidential discussions with coworkers for understanding what is really going on with the business, with budgets, with whatever demons the brand folks are flirting with. And generally speaking, informal desk meetings and socializing during breaks was artificial when forced and non-existent otherwise.

It was sad to go to holiday parties and see some of the introverted young guys so hungry for in-person contact and chats.

When I joined a hybrid office, I found I was very short with people in-person and was very demanding. Remote work had left me sensitive to and irritated with faults I perceived in people, and I had to consciously work to soften up with them.

I know many remote workers have drunk the koolaid and are very passionate about it, God bless 'em. I personally think it's shortsighted and weakens our bargaining power.

When my grumbliest coworkers eventually self-exit as the RTO announcements inevitably roll in, its partly a relief, but I worry about them and my industry.

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#339

Post by array_key_first »

TRiG_Ireland wrote: post #283
wiseowise wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would also not judge you for having your own preferences and opinions. I too prefer working in an office to remote work, but when I say this out loud other developers take it as advocating RTO or saying remote work is worse when it just doesn't suit my personality. I get that it's a touchy subject but there is no need to get up in my face about it. You ever wonder why? Serfes finally got freedom after corona, but…

That is a very strange (and very emotional) take. I find it easier to focus with some other people around me, so long as they're being quiet. An office (or a library) is easier to work in than my house. I also really like the idea of separation between my home and my workplace. If I was rich and had room in my house for a separate office I could close the door on when the workday was over, perhaps I'd feel differentl…

The main problem with the office work versus WFH debate debacle is that the positions are not on equal footing and, actually, are not equally valid.

Working in an office as a preference is one that naturally relies on the control of other people. The reason people like working in an office isn't because of the office. If you went to the office, by yourself, it would be worthless. The value of the office is the communal nature of it.

So, one position naturally requires forcing other people to work where they might not want to, and one doesn't. With WFH, you can work in an office, nothing is stopping you.

When you say you prefer working in an office, you aren't stating your preference. You're stating what you arbitrarily think everyone elses preference should be.

Re: Confessions of a Software Developer: No More Self-Censorship

#340

Post by array_key_first »

sailfast wrote: post #305
baq wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The problem in my opinion is that folks afraid of posting treat chat channels like email and official record instead of a conversation. They would be right: HR will get access to everything you ever posted in a company chat if they have a reason to check. Some people don’t care, some… do.

Fair point. It’s a record, but should not be treated as formally. Just because you are having a conversation doesn’t mean you have to breach HR guidelines. My comment was related more to the _overhead_ required before posting. Either way best not post anything that would be an HR issue in any format. (Also your private chats will be available in discovery as well if found out) Maybe I’m not the best to opine on this…

It's written communication on company infrastructure, tied to your real identity and org chart, and subject to retention policy.

Yes it absolutely is formal communication. Microsoft makes this painfully clear with how they market teams.

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