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Roc Camera

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Re: Roc Camera

#331

Post by wvlia5 »

peteforde wrote: post #62

I used to be really (really really) into photography. I respect anyone working hard on a physical product, but this misses the mark on every front I can think of. The real issue that photographers grapple with, emotionally and financially, is that pictures have become so thoroughly commodified that nobody assigns them cultural value anymore. They are the thumbnail you see before the short video clip starts playing. N…

This is not about photographers.

Imagine the president wants to deliver a video message. Was it authentic or AI generated? If it was filmed with this camera, the population can verify.

Re: Roc Camera

#332

Post by toobulkeh »

peteforde wrote: post #62

I used to be really (really really) into photography. I respect anyone working hard on a physical product, but this misses the mark on every front I can think of. The real issue that photographers grapple with, emotionally and financially, is that pictures have become so thoroughly commodified that nobody assigns them cultural value anymore. They are the thumbnail you see before the short video clip starts playing. N…

Maybe it’s not for common use? I could see this betting important in the intelligence community, for example.

Re: Roc Camera

#333

Post by dghlsakjg »

anonymous908213 wrote: post #161
dghlsakjg wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Huh? Tariffs shouldn’t prevent buying stuff, you just have to, y’know, pay a tariff on import. In this case, a Japanese made camera will incur a 15% tariff.

Most countries, including Japan, India, Canada, and nearly the entire EU, have completely stopped shipping packages to US consumers. This is not because of the tariffs themselves, but because the US apparently has no system in place for actually handling the tariffs on goods that previously qualified for the de minimis exemption. Two months and counting with no information on when shipping might resume.

Some merchants in those countries have stopped. There isn’t a general stoppage of everything.

I just checked and you can still send goods between Japan and the US. There are still merchants selling the exact mentioned camera on eBay that will ship to the US.

Here is the exact camera mentioned, offered by a Japanese seller, that will ship to the United States: https://www.ebay.com/itm/317445808304

Can you source your claim that absolutely no courier is capable of shipping goods into the US? I can’t find anything using google, or on any courier websites.

FedEx does have information about how to correctly fill out the forms for the purposes of tariffs, but does not mention that they will not accept shipments.

Re: Roc Camera

#335

Post by torginus »

bborud wrote: post #213
barrell wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also used to be really (really really) into photography. Personally, I’ve stopped taking pictures because of the stigma around a camera. Everyone, me more than most, doesn’t want their picture taken, or to be in the background of other photos. When someone can take thousands of pictures an hour, and upload them all to some social media site to be permanently stored… idk it’s shifted from a way to capture a moment t…

The concept of «public» has changed. About 15-20 years ago I attended a lot of car events (races, shows) where I took lots of photos. Mostly of moving cars, but also a lot of closeups of race car drivers using a long lens. For about a year more than half the photos published in a very niche car publication were by me. The magazine had a few thousand subscribers. And to this day I still see some drivers use my shots o…

This gave me an idea - what if we made a stable diffusion based AI that would replace unimportant faces (and possibly other identifying details) with different ones - I have seen that AI can do this and make the change unnoticeable.

That way people would be safe from having their personal likeness and whereabouts accidentally plastered over the internet (except when they want their photo to be taken), and the end result wouldn't look so obviously modified as blurring faces or licence plates.

Re: Roc Camera

#336

Post by vwcx »

torginus wrote: post #335
bborud wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The concept of «public» has changed. About 15-20 years ago I attended a lot of car events (races, shows) where I took lots of photos. Mostly of moving cars, but also a lot of closeups of race car drivers using a long lens. For about a year more than half the photos published in a very niche car publication were by me. The magazine had a few thousand subscribers. And to this day I still see some drivers use my shots o…

This gave me an idea - what if we made a stable diffusion based AI that would replace unimportant faces (and possibly other identifying details) with different ones - I have seen that AI can do this and make the change unnoticeable. That way people would be safe from having their personal likeness and whereabouts accidentally plastered over the internet (except when they want their photo to be taken), and the end res…

That's a solution that prioritizes privacy over reality, and I'm not sure we collectively want that. Mutilation of truth in the name of protection etc...

Re: Roc Camera

#337

Post by rkomorn »

bborud wrote: post #305
rkomorn wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree we're already in a bad place but I don't find the "ship has sailed" take particularly engaging. Addressing nothing because everything can't be addressed isn't a great strategy for change.

I wasn't trying to make a "ship has sailed"-argument, but rather the argument that going after photography is odd given how little we care about surveillance and data collection that is far more invasive, complete and dangerous. If this were an optimization problem (optimizing for privacy and reducing criminal behavior), going after people who take pictures in public wouldn't even be on the radar. It isn't even a rou…

I don't think we have anything close to diametrically opposed views, for the most part.

When it comes to following lines of reasoning to absurd conclusions though, in the other direction, don't we end up in a world where it is everyone's right (private or public for that matter) to surveil everyone at all times the moment they step outside?

Isn't that something you have an issue with? An extension of the existing problem with data brokers, including ones that record data from interactions on their private space (eg our access to their products in their stores, etc)?

You're definitely right that there are worse offenders out there than "randos taking pictures", but it doesn't have to be an either-or thing.

Plus, I'd suspect that almost anyone who thinks it's not great that every other person on the street can now record them and post it on social media for engagement also doesn't like the other bits of tracking and surveillance you bring up, so if anything, they are probably your overzealous allies.

Re: Roc Camera

#338

Post by dghlsakjg »

geor9e wrote: post #57
ares623 wrote: post #52

I don’t know what this gives that a film camera with slide film loaded doesn’t. Both cameras still allow “staging” a scene and taking a shot of that. Both cameras will both say that the scene was shot in the physical world, but that’s it. I would argue that slide film is more “verifiable” in the ways that matter: easier to explain to laypeople how slide film works, and it’s them that you want to convince. If I was a…

Can't find slide printing services easily put AI images onto slide film for you? I think the point of this movement toward cryptographically signing image sensors is so people can confidently prove images are real on the internet in a momentary click, without having to get hold of the physical original and hiring a forensic lab to analyze it.

You can get things printed onto a transparency mounted in a slide frame. Actual slide film, though, must be done by exposing light. When you want another image put onto a slide, the easiest way to do it is to just take a picture using a camera.

That’s beside the broader point that OP made: it doesn’t matter since you can just point a verifiable camera at a staged scene (or reproduction of an AI image) and have an image of something that doesn’t represent reality. You can cryptographically sign, or have an original slide, of an image that is faked outside the camera.

Re: Roc Camera

#339

Post by bentcorner »

LandR wrote: post #308
oxalorg wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have clicked about ~20,000 photographs on a Sony camera in the last year and a half. And I have published exactly 0 of those photos on social media. Whenever I meet my friends and family, I show them the pictures myself and the story behind them. I love the thrill of street photography and it gives me immense pleasure to capture candid moments of humans. It's a great creative outlet for me and helps me think about…

As someone who would love to get into street photography, and has an old NIkdon D7100, what would you recommend is a good lense (not model, but focal length, zoom, etc) for street photography ?

It all depends on what you want to do. If you want to get started cheaply the kit lens is more than enough.

Prime lenses will have larger apertures that can give you more creative options.

How close do you want to stand? Indoor/outdoors? What are you planning on taking pictures of? D7100 is APS-C, I find that 50mm (~75mm ff) on APS-C doesn't give you quite enough room indoors to take photos. So you might want a 35mm prime or a zoom that goes down there. If you're planning on taking portraits you don't want something too wide (~20mm and below can be good for real estate/architecture) because it makes people look weird.

Most everything else is dictated by how much you want to spend and how large/heavy you want your camera to be.

Personally I have a 35mm f1.8 on my camera and am happy with it, I use it for family outings, a lot of portrait-level shots and just general "hey we're at the museum" kind of photos.

Re: Roc Camera

#340

Post by bdcravens »

Are they releasing the STL to let people print their own shell? If not, seems odd to advertise the fact that it's 3d printed with standard (Bambu Lab) printers.
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