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ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

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Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#331

Post by adastra22 »

1659447091 wrote: post #181
hombre_fatal wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was on a 90 day prescription for ten years (vyvanse) when I told my doctor I was traveling abroad. Insurance doesn’t cover 90 day bottles so it was $300/mo but worth it. Nowadays there’s generic Vyvanse which is much cheaper so it probably makes 90 day prescriptions financially viable? I just moved back to the US and had to find a new local doctor who gives me 30 day scripts so I haven’t asked about 90 day yet. I i…

> I just moved back to the US and had to find a new local doctor who gives me 30 day scripts You may have difficultly getting a 90 day, both the doc and pharmacist have to agree to do it - 3x30 day with 'fill on dates' is more likely. When I had a long out of town trip I was able to get a 60 day script. When I came back the doc sent 60 day script again but the pharmacist wouldn't fill it and only allowed it because w…

You can get $100/mo generic Vyvanse from Walgreens with GoodRx.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#332

Post by lazide »

baby_souffle wrote: post #157
teamonkey wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That reminds me of an article I read which claimed that being diagnosed with ADHD will prevent you from being a commercial pilot. Pilots will avoid getting diagnosed and medicated because it will kill their career, even though medication may make them safer. (I suspect ADHD pilots would handle takeoff and landing very well, as well as emergencies, but oh god the checklists and schedules and that whole middle part of…

> Pilots will avoid getting diagnosed and medicated because it will kill their career, even though medication may make them safer. Yeah, it's an issue! To the best of my understanding, it's not a mark against you if you have had treatment in the past. You can't have a valid license and be taking active treatment, though.

It is definitely a mark against you, in that you must do a huge amount of additional work proving it is no longer a problem.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#333

Post by LoganDark »

adastra22 wrote: post #328
LoganDark wrote: post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I still struggle to see how it's used recreationally. - Adderall keeps you awake. Some people use that to be awake for very long periods of time. Long drives, marathons, etc. - Adderall can make boring tasks seem engaging, so it can be used, for example, to help a student study. Combining that with no need to sleep that night, can become a bit of an unfair advantage. - Adderall can cause a high, even though I've on…

> Adderall keeps you awake For many (not all) ADHD'ers, amphetamine or caffeine makes them sleepy. > Adderall can make boring tasks seem engaging This is true > so it can be used, for example, to help a student study ... can become a bit of an unfair advantage Unfair? This isn't sports. Nobody is being cheated by a study-enhancing drug. > Adderall can cause a high, even though I've only ever experienced that with pur…

> For many (not all) ADHD'ers, amphetamine or caffeine makes them sleepy.

You're right, I was mainly speaking about people without ADHD using stimulants.

> Unfair? This isn't sports. Nobody is being cheated by a study-enhancing drug.

No, but it can lead to bad health effects for the student, and bad habits like dependence.

> Interesting. FYI ADHD people feel none of that.

I guess my ADHD diagnosis must be mistaken then? And my executive dysfunction must come from somewhere else...

ADHD is not a single neurotype. As even the most basic example, multiple different expressions of autism can each have ADHD.

> on stimulants ADHD people feel relaxed and normal, bringing them down from hyperactivity and allowing them to focus on their life.

Stimulants still help me regulate my sleep cycle and focus, but I don't think I experience hyperactivity from not being on them. (anymore at least; when I was younger I almost couldn't sleep without melatonin. That resolved itself before I ever touched stimulants, though.)

--

I have heard of people with undiagnosed ADHD self-medicating with meth. Slightly different than people without ADHD using stimulants recreationally. I personally hope to never touch meth because I heard it can ruin one's relationship with other stimulants, and I don't want my medication to become any sort of recreational thing because I need to depend on it and not seek highs, but I feel like self-medication can be perfectly valid if someone knows what they are doing. Big if though.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#334

Post by bratwurst3000 »

bawolff wrote: post #300
unmole wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

- Supply chains - Skilled workforce - Risk capital - Regulatory overhead

Other drugs are made outside the USA, what is so special about adderal (besides us regulations which other countries dont have to listen to)

the article is about methylphenydat (ritalin) and not adderall. Amphetamie is such an easy molekul, stepping up production should be super easy.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#335

Post by safety1st »

bawolff wrote: post #300
unmole wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

- Supply chains - Skilled workforce - Risk capital - Regulatory overhead

Other drugs are made outside the USA, what is so special about adderal (besides us regulations which other countries dont have to listen to)

Probably that it's basically a weaker form of meth. I mean they're chemically similar, they have the same effects, adderall is potentially addictive, nobody wants to end up dealing with something similar to America's meth epidemic. That's not to say you can't manufacture and prescribe this drug safely, but a lot more people are going to have a lot more reservations about it than if you want to crank out a generic Tylenol or something.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#336

Post by nicholta »

will_e wrote: post #320
astrange wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't matter who funds a study if it's properly designed. You see this kind of dismissal on /r/science all the time and it's always just evidence that they're not qualified to actually read the study.

Respectfully disagree. I knew someone that worked for the tobacco industry where they had labs that constantly were looking for reasons that tobacco was good for you. It meets your qualifications for properly designed studies, but it was purely about trying to convince convinced others that a known addictive substance that caused emphysema and lung cancer was beneficial to your health. Something similar happened in t…

> convince convinced

You probably didn’t mean to add “convinced”.

https://truthinitiative.org/research-resources/tobacco-indus...

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2564674/#:~:text=In...

> massive amounts of energy to fund vertical gardening

You probably instead meant “massive amounts of energy in vertical gardening”.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41893-021-00691-w

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8349047/#:~:text=Ho...

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#338

Post by bratwurst3000 »

adastra22 wrote: post #325
tstrimple wrote: post #247

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the DEA now takes potential abuse of legal drugs much more seriously and adderall (an amphetamine- it's a cousin of meth) is at a high risk of abuse. I know that I process Adderall differently having ADHD, but I still struggle to see how it's used recreationally. I took it somewhat consistently for over a year for ADHD treatment until I missed an appointment and couldn't get around to scheduling another before my p…

My doc says the best diagnostic for whether you have ADHD is to prescribe Adderall and see what happens. Those with ADHD react very, VERY differently to the drug than the rest of the population.

i dont think thats true. I have ADHD and get amphetamine as medication. I gave it some friends and it had similiar effect as with me. they where hyper focused and aware. I think its what amphetamine does with every human. Regular humans have more focus and adhd people have suddenly focus but netherless same.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#339

Post by adastra22 »

LoganDark wrote: post #333
adastra22 wrote: post #328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Adderall keeps you awake For many (not all) ADHD'ers, amphetamine or caffeine makes them sleepy. > Adderall can make boring tasks seem engaging This is true > so it can be used, for example, to help a student study ... can become a bit of an unfair advantage Unfair? This isn't sports. Nobody is being cheated by a study-enhancing drug. > Adderall can cause a high, even though I've only ever experienced that with pur…

> For many (not all) ADHD'ers, amphetamine or caffeine makes them sleepy. You're right, I was mainly speaking about people without ADHD using stimulants. > Unfair? This isn't sports. Nobody is being cheated by a study-enhancing drug. No, but it can lead to bad health effects for the student, and bad habits like dependence. > Interesting. FYI ADHD people feel none of that. I guess my ADHD diagnosis must be mistaken th…

My blanket statement was perhaps too broad. There are less than 10% of ADHD people whom do not demonstrate the paradoxical response to stimulants. That said, the percentage of misdiagnosis is at least that high, which makes one wonder. Mild bipolar is often misdiagnosed as ADHD, for example, and often discovered exactly because stimulants don't work as expected.

I missed on first read that you said the stimulants only had that high for the first few weeks though. That sounds different from what I understand to be the neurotypical response.

> Stimulants still help me regulate my sleep cycle and focus, but I don't think I experience hyperactivity from not being on them.

You may have the distracted variation rather than hyperactive.

Re: ADHD drug treatment and risk of negative events and outcomes

#340

Post by adastra22 »

bratwurst3000 wrote: post #338
adastra22 wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My doc says the best diagnostic for whether you have ADHD is to prescribe Adderall and see what happens. Those with ADHD react very, VERY differently to the drug than the rest of the population.

i dont think thats true. I have ADHD and get amphetamine as medication. I gave it some friends and it had similiar effect as with me. they where hyper focused and aware. I think its what amphetamine does with every human. Regular humans have more focus and adhd people have suddenly focus but netherless same.

Focus is the same. It's the euphoric high and increased hyperactivity in neurotypicals which is the divergent response.
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