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I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

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Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#331

Post by criddell »

DeathArrow wrote: post #165
CursedSilicon wrote: post #6

I wish that Framework could attain the same lofty levels of "second hand market success" that ThinkPads enjoy. A lot of the "Thinkpad fans" I've talked to genuinely want them, or respect them for similar reasons they enjoy the ThinkPad legacy. ThinkPads are durable but every day they get older, slower and more difficult to source parts for as collectors entrench themselves and the requirements of operating systems (a…

>ThinkPads are durable but every day they get older, slower and more difficult to source parts for as collectors entrench themselves and the requirements of operating systems (and the "modern web") worsen That's true for every computer. But people still buy old C64, Amiga, Atari, IBM or Apple computers.

> But people still buy old C64, Amiga, Atari, IBM or Apple computers.

Not in meaningful numbers.

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#332

Post by RunSet »

sfn42 wrote: post #173
maccard wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When would you define as “before”? I’ve had a thinkpad on and off and I’d describe the quality as consistent. People talking about old Lenovos being good quality are often talking about in the pre-IBM days which is far more likely to be nostalgia at this point.

My first ThinkPad had terrible battery life. It was a X1 Extreme or something like that, pretty high end but the battery was useless. Even brand new it wouldn't last an hour off leash. Also couldn't use usb-c charging from the monitors at the office, had to be plugged in. Also the Fn key is where the Ctrl key should be, which is endlessly annoying as a user of different laptop brands.

IBM invented the Fn key so if anyone has their Fn key where the Ctrl key should be, it is the copycats.

> The Fn key first debuted on the monochrome display ThinkPad 300 in October of 1992. Yes there was a ThinkPad with a monochrome display. The Fn key circa 1992 was placed exactly as it is today. Interestingly enough, Apple uses the same positions for their Fn and Ctrl keys as ThinkPad. Every other notebook personal computer manufacturer that I know of has the Fn and Ctrl key positions swapped. Some would say backwards.

https://web.archive.org/web/20110130203223/https://www.lenov...

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#333

Post by criddell »

ivraatiems wrote: post #48

I love these old ThinkPads. I refurbish and sell them all the time. Just moments before writing this, I finished fixing up a T580; earlier today I did a heatsink replacement on a W510 which is going strong with an SSD and 20GB RAM. The older they are, the better they are, but even the modern ones are still pretty good. Like the OP mentions, the market for parts is strong and it's easy to get what you need. Then when…

I have a T520. What can I do to make this thing useful again? Even when new, the battery life was pretty awful.

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#334

Post by cosmic_cheese »

makeitdouble wrote: post #55
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Framework’s offerings are interesting, but after having gotten used to the solid rigidity of M-series MacBooks and X1 series Thinkpads, the level of flex in the Framework 13 is a major issue for me. It’s difficult to justify for the price, plus PCBs and repeated flex stress don’t mix nicely. I think it’s time for either Framework or a third party partner to sell a new chassis that’s compatible with the FW13’s mainboa…

At least the M1~2 series Macbooks scratched the screen with the keyboard. Mines did, and asking second hand resailers it was a very common issue. Rigidity is only for the main body, not the screen part.

FWIW, I’ve been toting around the 16” M-series models since they launched and recently picked up a 13” Air and have yet to see this occur. Haven’t heard reports of it from coworkers or friends either. Not saying it doesn’t happen, but I suspect there’s a particular action or pattern of behavior that makes it more likely, such as placing it under heavy objects or packing it in tightly with books or something like that.

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#335

Post by TaupeRanger »

ajxs wrote: post #16

My x220 has traveled around the world multiple times. It's been through dozens of airport scanners, dropped multiple times, and shared a few cups of coffee with me by accident. It just keeps on kicking. My x220 running Debian is actually quicker and more responsive than my friend's modern Lenovo running Windows. I'd be tempted to upgrade to a lighter and thinner laptop, but I'm too attached to the keyboard.

Airport scanners? Are those normally dangerous to laptops?

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#336

Post by [deleted] »

simgt wrote: post #226
myaccountonhn wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's an attitude worth challenging. The minerals required to build these laptops are limited, and one day we will have to realize this and care for what we own.

Easily swappable components also increase resources consumption. We don't necessary want or need to be able to fix all the parts of our laptops or cars (or shoes!) at home, but we definitely want and need a local professional to be able to do so for a reasonable cost.

[deleted]

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#337

Post by MonkeyClub »

vvpan wrote: post #27

Off-topic about the Nassim Nicholas Taleb opening: Does anybody else feel like he just restates obvious things in a more formalized and somewhat pompous way? I do not mind formalization but I feel like I am supposed to swoon over it as if some profound truth, that was not already implied in our every day thinking, was being revealed.

> just restates obvious things in a more formalized and somewhat pompous way

That's sort of the premise of his Black Swan idea, namely that extraordinary things appear quite obvious in retrospect.

I've read a few of his books, including Antifragile that's referenced in TFA, and he does go beyond merely restating (or formalizing) the obvious.

But then again perhaps such things are not generally obvious and need to be stated explicitly, we just happen to be part of a subset that is more aware of them.

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#338

Post by cosmic_cheese »

adgjlsfhk1 wrote: post #56
cosmic_cheese wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Framework’s offerings are interesting, but after having gotten used to the solid rigidity of M-series MacBooks and X1 series Thinkpads, the level of flex in the Framework 13 is a major issue for me. It’s difficult to justify for the price, plus PCBs and repeated flex stress don’t mix nicely. I think it’s time for either Framework or a third party partner to sell a new chassis that’s compatible with the FW13’s mainboa…

imo the modular ports are a massive longevity feature. charging cable ports are one of the most common laptop killers, so making that modular is a huge step up

Modular ports are good, but I’m not sure I need to be able to hot swap them.

Larger port module plates that bolt into the sides of the chassis with a few screws would be just as good from a longevity standpoint, would enable better rigidity, and would allow the FW13 to host a considerably higher number of ports.

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#339

Post by cosmic_cheese »

numpad0 wrote: post #303
mikae1 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I see it, an aluminum slab MNT Reform Next[1] would be a better Thinkpad replacement than a Framework (from a build and reparability standpoint). [1] https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/mnt-reform-next

Every time I see any of those MNT machines in pictures, it makes my fingers start frantically typing out lengthy rants whether it's about internals or externals or even choices of colors.

Yeah I respect the project and mission but it’s not for me for various reasons.

Re: I maintain a 17 year old ThinkPad

#340

Post by Muvasa »

janitor77swe wrote: post #263
AshamedCaptain wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the only thing you will be able to replace is the battery and the screen. Both which 99% users never have to replace. This is sarcasm, I hope, right? The two most consumable items in the laptop (specially for OLED screens), and you're suggesting users have no need to replace them?

Yes that's exactly what I'm suggesting. The two things I never had to replace since I got my first laptop in the late 90s, not do I know anyone who had to replace those.

Literally the battery is the only thing I had to replace on every laptop I've had.
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