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How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

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Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#331

Post by hashtag-til »

stavros wrote: post #124
hashtag-til wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From my experience, you build that non-fluff boundaries in the first one or two meetings with a senior leader. I’d advise against going in the first one throwing punches. Go with actionable feedback and be honest about what it is and what is not something you can solve. From there, if you genuinely care about whatever you’re complaning, you are more likely to be taken seriously.

> I’d advise against going in the first one throwing punches. I’d advise against going in any one throwing punches. Instead, give actionable, honest, factual feedback with the intent to legitimately help the other person.

Fair enough, while I agree, in real project life, this calm, honest, factual feedback isn’t always enough for senior management to prioritise your issue.

Sometimes you need to a bit more assertive and blunt so that you become the top of the agenda, that’s what I meant by “throwing punches”.

Perhaps it means a much more over the top attitude in your view? (Happy to be corrected here)

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#332

Post by stavros »

hashtag-til wrote: post #331
stavros wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I’d advise against going in the first one throwing punches. I’d advise against going in any one throwing punches. Instead, give actionable, honest, factual feedback with the intent to legitimately help the other person.

Fair enough, while I agree, in real project life, this calm, honest, factual feedback isn’t always enough for senior management to prioritise your issue. Sometimes you need to a bit more assertive and blunt so that you become the top of the agenda, that’s what I meant by “throwing punches”. Perhaps it means a much more over the top attitude in your view? (Happy to be corrected here)

If I need an issue prioritized, I'd have a discussion with senior leadership until one of us was convinced of the other's viewpoint, or we understood why we can't agree. For example, if my issue is clearly higher priority than anything else, I should easily be able to demonstrate that to senior leadership, and vice-versa. If we can't agree for a specific reason, we can say "the data is too fuzzy to know either way" and try to minimize risk.

Not all organizations will work like this, but that's a dysfunction that will need to be corrected. In that case, you should do what works (and that will be different for everyone), my particular situation won't apply to your particular situation.

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#333

Post by phist_mcgee »

jajko wrote: post #190
lazide wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most people can, some people can’t - and the ones who can’t can be incredibly dangerous.

Yeah good luck with getting anything, ever, out of folks that feel butt-hurt due to their fragile emotions, in my experience women often go the extra mile to hold grudges, while sporting big smiles publicly.. That gate is closed for good, and you really have no idea what to expect - be it silent treatment or even subversion and backstabbing. To summarize - each of us is pretty unique, and without going though it you…

You sound like a ray of sunshine

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#334

Post by ElevenLathe »

These seem like decent tricks but make sure the juice is worth the squeeze. IME you can't change anyone's mind about anything, and trying will usually piss them off. If you don't like your boss, go shopping for a new one instead of trying to reform the one you have.

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#335

Post by carimura »

palata wrote: post #42

In my 13 years of experience, I would say it's never worth giving feedback to your manager. Either they are good and it's useless, or they are not and they won't learn from you. I have come to a simple rule: if the manager is good, there is no problem. If the manager sucks (often that's because they lack experience, but it's all the same), just lie to them in order to preserve yourself. No need to have empathy for th…

wow that's quite black or white. really good managers should want your feedback. even if there are no obvious problems, groups can always be better. and don't forget sometimes large problems start small.

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#336

Post by freejazz »

lijok wrote: post #6

Astonishing. Completely backwards. This article describes how to give feedback to your subordinates, not to your superiors. If your superiors are unable to process no-fluff information, regardless of whether it's feedback or updates, they have no business lording over anyone and will sink whatever function they have oversight of. If you find yourself working under such people, don't bother giving feedback, start poli…

> they have no business lording over anyone and will sink whatever function they have oversight of.

Be sure to tell them that too!

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#337

Post by lazide »

lijok wrote: post #308
chipdart wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If your superiors are unable to process no-fluff information, regardless of whether it's feedback or updates, they have no business lording over anyone and will sink whatever function they have oversight of. You're arguing based on how you think the world should be instead of how the world actually is.

Are you suggesting that functions overseen by those unable to process no-fluff information, are often successful and do not sink?

What happens when all functions are overseen by people unable to process no-fluff information.

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#338

Post by lisper »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #69
thethirdone wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems like a very shallow way of thinking. "Losing all respect for the person" implies that you think this is NEVER an appropriate way to address someone. Phrasing a disagreement of opinion as a question of reasoning is often the best course of action. In particular if a choice has been made and going back to reverse it has significant costs, it is important to not say anything like "We should not be doing this"…

> What would you say to a superior who made a decision that you disagree with, but don't think is worth reversing? "I don't understand ... it seems it has the consequence of ... My professional opinion in that case would be... and I would advise to... because of... Is there something I'm not seeing here?" Benefits: - I'm not faking it. - I already provide a lot of information up front to limit back-and-forth. This av…

> Is there something I'm not seeing here?

That's essentially the same thing. The only difference is that you're putting your uncertainty at the end and I'm putting it at the beginning. The key is to explicitly acknowledge that you recognize the possibility that you might be wrong.

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#339

Post by gorjusborg »

Answer: they need to be open to hearing it first, and you need to be someone they trust.

How to build trust? Make it clear you are on their 'side'.

Luckily giving feedback can be that way:

- Give any positive feedback publicly

- Give any negative feedback privately

- Rather than give negative feedback, come with concrete things that could be done to improve things. Try not to assign blame.

Do this consistently while being good at your job and they are more likely to not misinterpret your opinions as rationalization

Re: How to give a senior leader feedback without getting fired

#340

Post by codr7 »

loup-vaillant wrote: post #263
codr7 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The difference is the damage done. I don't think training managers on real people is a good idea.

Genuine question: how do we train managers, then? Surgeons have pigs, but even then it's not perfect, and there comes a point where they have to perform surgeries on actual humans (hopefully under supervision).

Mentoring?
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