Live data from Hacker News

Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

arxiv.org

331–340 of 598 posts

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#331
post #67

Is this a new phenomenon? My dad told me, that when he was in the office in the 1980s and 1990s, his manager would always keep a job opening active. The manager's goal was to be able to be opportunistic and snap up someone awesome when they came though.

Some companies have a future opening listing for this purpose. so now it becomes unclear

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#332
post #17

A question I've had on my mind for a while now, watching this progression of fake or poisoned jobs, and miles of automatic systems to navigate: At what point do people consider the well poisoned? Where they just check out and stop applying, to specific companies or in general, because its very very obvious that there isnt actually a valid hiring market at all. I ask this question, because I've already passed this thr…

It really depends on the position of the prospective employee. An unemployed person who needs a job should theoretically spend their workday hours on recruitment efforts. The prevalence of fake jobs might affect which roles they apply for but not the total number of applications. However for employed individuals seeking a promotion it can have a big impact. Is it worth spending many hours of your leisure time applyin…

The 'well could be poisoned' for unemployed people as well. Applying to job adverts isn't the only type of recruitment efforts; there is also further education and tending to professional social networks - the unemployed individual could easily consider these more valuable than applying to probably fake job adverts. Ultimately, this still hurts both worker and employer, because it just delays gainful employment and hides information from the market.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#333
post #14

I have to put out a ghost job req and interview every person applying within reason for every green card a direct report is applying for. I have to show there are or aren’t any residents or citizens that can fill the job The main problem is: even if the interviewee knocks it out of the park, is an amazing engineer, I still am not interested in firing my OPT/h1b team member who can still legally work for 2-3 years. So…

The H1B system is so rife with corruption at every level and needs to be stopped.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

CTO actually makes sense for an h1b though, it’s a high paying job that can depend greatly on the technical and creative skills of the individual and how they mesh with the company. The problem is when it’s someone pumping out code, or doing tech support for half the cost of the local competition.

No, this is backwards CTO is not such an exceptional role that you can convince me that a company couldn't find a single person in America who would be qualified to take it It's also a highly sought after role, so people would generally be willing to relocate for a role like that H1Bs are designed to fill labour shortages, where your local labour market is saturated and you are struggling to find local talent or attr…

[deleted]

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This means small companies may not get good talent that value things besides salary (wfh, perks, fun project) and will have to compete with corporations for people who only cares about money. This may (or may not) impact startups

Stop it, no one "values things besides salary", and you know it.

If you people only valued salary you'd all be in sales :)

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait, this isn't clear to me. Are the interviewees citizens? So you're interviewing citizens to prove that there aren't any who can fill your jobs but even when they clearly could fill the job you don't hire them? Seems like the requirement of proving "there are or aren’t any residents or citizens that can fill the job" is going to be near impossible for the government to enforce

the person applying for the green card already works for the interviewing company. the job opening is THAT green card applicant's job requirements. the lawyer/law firm handling the green card application process has to prove that there are no US citizens who are qualified to do the job. if there were qualified applicants for the job, then the green card applicant won't be given a green card, I assume. But that green…

If the labor market test yields a candidate, the petition isn't filed. So there is formally no rejection from the USCIS. But application processes fail at this step all the time.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are actually situations where U.S. citizenship can be a requirement, e.g., cleared jobs but there needs to be a really good reason like not being able to obtain clearances.

SpaceX has been through the wringer on this one, so just copy & paste from their listing: To conform to U.S. Government export regulations, applicant must be a (i) U.S. citizen or national, (ii) U.S. lawful, permanent resident (aka green card holder), (iii) Refugee under 8 U.S.C. § 1157, or (iv) Asylee under 8 U.S.C. § 1158, or be eligible to obtain the required authorizations from the U.S. Department of State. Learn…

The SpaceX case was centered around ITAR regulations. ITAR jobs do not necessarily require security clearance. As the person you responded to mentioned, you have to be a citizen to get security clearance and related jobs. Asylum seekers and refugees can't get clearance.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#338
post #9

>The trend could be due to the low marginal cost of posting additional job ads and to maintain a pipeline of talents. After adjusting for yearly trends, I find that ghost jobs can explain the recent disconnect in the Beveridge Curve in the past fifteen years. The results show that policy-makers should be aware of such a practice as it causes significant job fatigue and distorts market signals. Very interesting. I cer…

Not uncommon for in-house recruiters to keep sourcing new candidates and making them jump through all interviewing hoops even if they know the reqs aren’t open or till the morning they all get fired in a layoff that they know is coming. Agencies probably less so because they get paid commission.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there any evidence H1B workers in tech have lowered wages? I have only seen anecdotes while the law explicitly states H1Bs should be paid the prevailing wage or above.

It's what I would naturally expect to happen in the absence of consistent heroic efforts by the authorities to prevent it.

If that is happening widely, surely there will be some data to support that right?

Authorities do enforce H1B provisions proactively.

https://www.uscis.gov/scams-fraud-and-misconduct/report-frau...

https://cis.org/North/Apple-Hit-25-Million-Penalty-Favoring-...

https://www.mercurynews.com/2024/11/06/h-1b-visa-fraud-leads...

> absence of consistent heroic efforts

Will that apply to every law in society or just to H1B laws?

Despite absence of consistent heroic efforts, we don't see widespread criminal activities.

Re: Why is it so hard to find a job now? Enter Ghost Jobs

#340
post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talking to a couple of people who found jobs recently, I realized that none of them actually found the job by applying online. All of them are through human relationships. It doesn't have to be someone who knew someone, but even an outsourced recruiting agency staffed by humans in a call center is more useful than applying online. The better recruiting agencies usually have an account manager who has a direct line to…

I got hired by directly applying via a company's website; it was my 11th application and my first that wasn't a moonshot (nvda/valve/etc). It was in late 2023 (very bad market), and I didn't have any connections to the company at all. I also have no online presence. Online applications are not fully dead. Of course this is just my experience as a senior engineer in embedded, so likely doesn't apply to others. But if…

I have a suspicion that your experience is representative of a general attitude in embedded engineering compared to other software disciplines. Embedded engineers usually still keep to proper part numbering, testing before shipping and working with greater platform limitations, all virtuous activities that are harder to find in other fields. I like to think this culture bleeds into other parts of the business such as implementing reasonable hiring processes!
Post reply on HN