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Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

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Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#331

Post by tsimionescu »

helboi4 wrote: post #318
tsimionescu wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not at all a hyper capitalist. I would even consider myself anti-capitalist. But imposing your own preferred art on public commons is a (minor) form of violence, in any economic system. Especially when you do so with paints of questionable chemical composition, or with images/text that is likely to offend. I would also say that doing the same thing even on your own property can be reprehensible, as long as it is…

Think about it this way, if we all owned all public structures, then we all have equal rights to paint it just as much as you have the right to paint your own house. The graffiti artist has the right to paint it, you have the right to hate it. You have the right to paint something they hate, or paint over their stuff. Nobody should be being prosecuted by a higher power for a minor disagreement about artistic taste. U…

No, this is completely wrong. If we own a public structure together, then neither of us has any right to change it except if we both agree to the change. You can't take individual actions on shared goods: you need a process of attaining the consensus of everyone involved (such as voting).

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#332

Post by carlosjobim »

soco wrote: post #189
atoav wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone with an art degree (with no great admiration for street art per sé) I have to ask one question: Could you imagine that one person's "defaced" is another person's "finally some colors"? The destruction of property, trespassing etc. is obviously on the wrong side of the law, but on purely aesthetical terms this could be argued either way making it for that narrow category a subjective thing. Proponents of gr…

Let's be honest, 99.999% of graffiti is smeared black lines barely recognizable as tags, over more smeared tags and curse words and just dirt. If that is aesthetic, we might have a very different definition of aesthetic than the art schools you mention. Do I see sometimes street art? Yes, but almost never on such places - the real street art is one done on commission (I assume) on some private house walls, while the…

There is a word missing in the English language that confuses this discussion. Graffiti has come to mean air brush, whether it's art or vandalism. Other languages have separate words for these things.

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#333

Post by broken-kebab »

nicolas_t wrote: post #283
highcountess wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is not relative at all to rational people. Let me just put it this way, do I get to just move into your home and take it over simply because I believe that I can make it a better home than you can? Do I get to steal your car/property because I believe I can make better use of it? Stop rationalizing narcissistic behavior and people trying to impose themselves on others. It’s not relative at all. You or the narcissisti…

The nice thing is that in democracies you can influence what is done against graffitis. Don't like graffitis? try to push your local representatives etc to be stricter on them or move to a country that has no graffiti like Singapore. One of the most sterile, boring city in the world. For whatever reasons, Germany is rather lenient towards graffiti artists which, in my eyes, makes Berlin more enjoyable than it would b…

>or move to a country that has no graffiti like Singapore. One of the most sterile, boring city in the world.

People who pretend to make art on walls are absolute minority compared to those who'd prefer to keep walls clean, or painted, or whatever (there are plenty of options between gray, and wannabe artists spraying smileys). But somehow you offer the majority to leave. I don't think that's how it can work really

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#334

Post by broken-kebab »

nicolas_t wrote: post #225
72deluxe wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a strange argument that seems to romanticise this "border" called "the law". It is black and white: someone is defacing something that doesn't belong to them. You can call the result whatever you want ("art","expression" etc) but the fundamental issue doesn't change. Would you be happy to wake up and see your car covered in paint? What about the windows on your house? Would you see this as an "improvement" too?

I think I’d be relatively happy if I woke up one day and saw a banksy or an invader mosaic on my wall. I’ve seen graffiti art that definitely improved grey ugly walls and barriers. I’ve also seen ugly tags that are nothing more than letters. It’s relative

It only emphasizes the problem. There's only one Banksy, and millions prolific wall-defacers. You are unlikely to get the former, and almost guaranteed - the latter

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#335

Post by Rinzler89 »

tuukkah wrote: post #266
lqet wrote: post #4

> a transparent noise barrier Most rail noise barriers in Germany are completely covered in graffiti [0], so I wouldn't expect them to remain transparent for more than a few weeks. [0] https://ga.de/imgs/93/8/5/9/3/0/9/1/9/tok_8596521c60eeaa53ee...

DB is also deploying robot dogs against graffiti painters: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40388114

God I hope they graffiti the robot dogs as well because that would be so funny.

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#336

Post by tichiian »

broken-kebab wrote: post #322
tichiian wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An ugly beton brut building defaces the landscape and the view that should belong to everyone. A beautiful graffiti can improve that view and landscape. Under those circumstances, a graffiti can be legally wrong but morally right. However only very few graffiti "artists" rise above the skill level where their work could be considered beautiful. Usually it's just plain old dick measuring contests like spraying politic…

If it should belong to everyone as you claim, then every aspiring graffiti maker must ask everyone's opinion before starting spraying.

Basically, in my ideal world, whoever builds an ugly enough building should be liable to remove it or improve it if it is deemed too ugly by a majority.

Graffiti is (partially) just the consequence of not living in that ideal world, but because of all the other problems with graffiti, I'd rather just treat it as the vandalism it usually is in all cases. No sense holding an election before every prosecution or clean and paint job.

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#337

Post by tichiian »

stuffinmyhand wrote: post #315
constantcrying wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is exactly nothing about defacing public infrastructure which elicits the tiniest spark of "admiration" or "interest" in me. If you want to live out your "artistic ambitions" do it somewhere away from public property.

Berlin is colorful, live with it. If you place a gray wall somewhere, it will first be sprayed by some noobie. Then later by a better artist and a few years later, no one even dares to cross it because someone put a beautiful piece there. Every shitty graffiti is about to be replaced by a better one!

Berlin is also trying to improve it's standard of living, social structure, economic outlook and overall cleanliness. Graffiti vandalism will have less and less of a place there, and have a lessening acceptance.

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#338

Post by Loughla »

d0gsg0w00f wrote: post #314
bondarchuk wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meanwhile in non-defaced public property: https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c0/1_times_... The thing about a big city is it's not just about the people who own the stuff you look at, it's about all the other people who have to look at it. I'll take graffiti over advertising any day. At least graffiti isn't trying to sell me anything or make me depressed or addicted or whatever.

Everybody is selling something, especially graffiti artists. You just aren't the target demographic.

What are they selling

Re: Deutsche Bahn introduces "MetaWindow"

#340

Post by patates »

lukan wrote: post #295
Cthulhu_ wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For intercity trains it doesn't matter what the propulsion method is though, since every train will make a lot of noise at speed. It's improved with aerodynamics and better wheel / tracks, but ultimately noise will be an issue. Consider also cars where at speed the noise is not due to the engine, but to wheel / road noise.

I live outside the city, so I know the difference in sound at high speed when they pass by. It makes a great difference. Combustion vs electric but also the manufacturing and damping of the wheels etc. Steelwheel on steel can be very silent.

huh. rubber on asphalt is very loud on high speeds, could steel on steel really be quieter? (for downvoters: this is a real question, I'm not trying to suggest it can't be)
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