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Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

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Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#331

Post by hef19898 »

uneekname wrote: post #312
hef19898 wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just upgraded from a, I think, 6 year old Pixel 2 to a carrier discounted Pixel 7. Being in Germany, I am fairly certain tue bootloader is unlocked (-able), I might try it during the weekend. Reason forbthe switch was that a) even CalyxOS stopped supporting it b) the phone lost the mobile network evervso often c) the screen was held together by clue and proteczive glass. Otherwise, it isbstill working and will stay a…

I'd be interested to hear about your experience. My contact info is in my bio if you're up for it. I do really like the Pixel line, and I'd be excited to upgrade if I were sure the new device could be successfully unlocked. May I recommend LineageOS, which supports Pixel 7 [0] and the Pro version. Whatever you go with, yes I do think you can flash stock Android back on your phone if you like. [0] https://wiki.lineage…

In my experience, it worked great with a Pixel 2 XL. Except my botched attempt at getting stock back onto it, which resulted in warning during boot. Otherwise CalyxOS worked like a charm, incl. banking and 2FA apps.

We'll see when I have time, and patience, to get it on my new phone... Might be a while, so far I manage to convince myself that I got rid of almost all tracking so far...

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#332

Post by AnthonyMouse »

bippihippi1 wrote: post #289
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I love the idea of being able to unlock the bootloader. > I don't love the idea of someone else being able to do it before the phone gets to me. At the time it was their phone, and they can still do it by waiting 30 days. But what does it matter if you're just going to flash your own system anyway? Let them put whatever they want on it as long as you can blow it away and replace it with yours. And if you're not goi…

the preexisting firmware installs the bootloader, unless you mount the memory chips directly to your pc.

That isn't a law of nature. The device could easily have a tiny amount of actual ROM the sole purpose of which is to reflash the device, which would also be useful to recover from a bad flash.

And if you want to talk about security, the most secure thing is to make all of the storage easily removable so it can be verified and reflashed from a known-clean device. Which would also make it upgradable, at the expense of an imperceptible single-digit number of grams in weight. That they don't do this is the proof that the other thing isn't really done for security.

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#333

Post by justsomehnguy »

r00tanon wrote: post #131
justsomehnguy wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> this is bad because the vendor might Because the vendor can anytime say 'fuck you' and disable/remove the process which allows unlocking the bootloader. Edit: already happened with Pixel 2: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35854552

So anyone who has already unlocked their Pixel 2 is good to go right? Getting the latest Pixel unlocked requires an internet connection, but once done it's done. So the complaint is that in the far future the vendor might not support that on a six year old phone (by that time)? But, it is supported now, so what's the beef? My old Pixel 2 only works now plugged into power and on WIFI because the battery is dead. I can…

> So anyone who has already unlocked their Pixel 2 is good to go right?

So anyone who hasn't is fucked and you are fine with that?

> So the complaint is that in the far future

It's not a far future. It's already happening. And if decades ago it took up to years for a company to stop providing the services (or existing as a company) nowadays it takes mere weeks from the announcement.

And this is still not relevant to the problem - you can't do what you want with the device you paid full price for.

It's always amusing to hear people like you who defend the corporate behemoths at the expense of Regular Joe. "Embarrassed millionaires" vibe.

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#334

Post by Aeolun »

judge2020 wrote: post #201
Aeolun wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wut? I don’t follow? Anyway, once you are big enough to care about preventing bootloader unlocking on your company devices you are big enough to pay for that privilege.

You'd need two different SKUs for each different color and size to enable this in a more user-friendly way, where devices either enterprise locked or carrier locked get the one with a locked-by-default bootloader, and ones bought directly by the consumer have an unlocked bootloader. Realistically the latter group is so small it doesn't make sense to complicate the production and logistics process by having this separ…

The latter group is plenty big enough at the point of sale (e.g. every single store).

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#335

Post by dingledork69 »

Gigachad wrote: post #210
dingledork69 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you don't own it when you buy it. At best Google still owns it and they graciously allow you permission to change the bootloader after you submit to their terms of service. Also, better hope their servers are online and reachable, and that you have functional internet.

This is honestly the most overblown issue I've ever seen on HN. How many people are buying a brand new in box pixel to install a custom OS on and do not have an internet connection anywhere, not even a free public wifi? I'd be shocked if this impacts even a single person. At this point it's being angry for the sake of it.

It's possible to care about issues that infringe on people their rights even if they do not affect you personally.

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#336

Post by joshuamorton »

Aeolun wrote: post #334
judge2020 wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd need two different SKUs for each different color and size to enable this in a more user-friendly way, where devices either enterprise locked or carrier locked get the one with a locked-by-default bootloader, and ones bought directly by the consumer have an unlocked bootloader. Realistically the latter group is so small it doesn't make sense to complicate the production and logistics process by having this separ…

The latter group is plenty big enough at the point of sale (e.g. every single store).

At least in the US, most phones purchased in stores are carrier locked. I cannot purchase an unlocked pixel at most, if not all, nearby retailers.

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#338

Post by cduzz »

thomastjeffery wrote: post #323
cduzz wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So imagine a scenario: 1. crime organization (or governmental org) buys / steals a bunch of phones 2. org opens boxes, tampers with boot loader in such a way that they (and / or the original OEM and / or the original OS vendor) have a persistent remote administration account on phone 3. org then returns phones to supply chain either covertly or off the back of a truck. 4. org leverages remote access to do shady thing…

The answer to that should not be to become the shady seller.

In these modern times I don't think any company actually trusts the contractors that have been hired to make a product.

You (some big name company) hire some company to make 10,000 widgets; your contractors may turn around and make 300,000 widgets sell you the 10,000 widgets per the agreement and sell the other 290,000 into other channels. They may sell the ones that didn't pass QA, they may make ones with cheaper parts, etc.

How do you stop this? See above - the part has to phone home and you can enable it (or not!) because you've got a registry of which things are legit and which aren't.

Also, this lets the companies spy on you. Errr.. Collect telemetry to allow them to improve the product.

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#339

Post by neximo64 »

stefncb wrote: post #321
neximo64 wrote: post #139

I im honest I don't see the big deal with this practice. a) You can unlock the device b) You can connect via WiFi, why is the device 'phoning home' such a big deal when its brand new and has no data on it?

But what if I live somewhere remote without internet access? Such a simple thing as using the phone shouldn't be impossible.

How does a phone work in a place without any reception/internet?

Re: Pixel phones are sold with bootloader unlocking disabled

#340

Post by londons_explore »

londons_explore wrote: post #247
jifoxym wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

did it solve this problem? I bought my Xiaomi phone from a shady seller who tampered with it to unlock the bootloader, so that I avoid all of this. I'm probably not the only one.

Some of the AliExpress sellers use this ability to install a custom kernel that reports more RAM and Flash than is installed. Sometimes they report a higher android version number and CPU too, and if you run any popular benchmarks the results will be faked (through binary patching of the benchmark app). Then they sell the phone as a newer/better model than it is, and most users are unaware. If you complain to AliExpr…

I has an 'Android 13' which turned out to actually be android 4.2, but faking a higher version number.

The vast majority of apps won't run on android 4 anymore.

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