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Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

nytimes.com

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Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#331

Post by stuckinhell »

WORMS_EAT_WORMS wrote: post #186
mbgerring wrote: post #55

Nearly the entire point of the United States at its founding was that the law should apply to political leaders. We are overdue for setting the precedent of a former President being charged with a crime, and we ought to go back and charge a few other former Presidents with crimes while we’re at it.

Just need a mental gut check after reading this comment. Do people not think this is political?

When it comes to Trump, people seem to be blind to the effects of soft power. Trump is beloved by his base in a way no other president in the last 100 years is.

The danger of this half-assed prosecution to the republic is fucking enormous, I'm actually scared.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#332

Post by stuckinhell »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #212
mbgerring wrote: post #55

Nearly the entire point of the United States at its founding was that the law should apply to political leaders. We are overdue for setting the precedent of a former President being charged with a crime, and we ought to go back and charge a few other former Presidents with crimes while we’re at it.

It's kind of interesting because, according to a lot of other people (whether they are speaking factually or in an opinionated fashion), Trump has managed to avoid a lot of laws (inciting an insurrection, etc.). Why is this hush money thing the biggest law a Grand jury is able to stick on him? If he's supposedly guilty for so many other things, why is this all he's been indicted on the past few years? Genuinely askin…

Because Trump has nearly religious following that scares many many people on the left and right.

They will do ANYTHING to stop him out of fear, anger, arrogance etc. The problem here is Trump is an expert at reflection. This HAS ALREADY empowered his base, and strengthened Ron Desantis.

I think the hardest part to accept is nearly half the nation DOES NOT AGREE with progressive principles at their very core.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#333

Post by kcplate »

norwalkbear wrote: post #310
dmix wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also happened before he was a sitting president, so all the stuff about “Bush Iraq war crimes” and “Nixon’s burglary” and similar historical presidential baggage is mostly irrelevant, at least in terms of new precedent. The social/civil consequences of this sort of criminal indictment before election is enough to kill a presidential campaign and has enough times in history. As it should be. This is behaviour bef…

[flagged]

In terms of tearing the country apart…I think you need to separate the nut jobs who idolize Trump from the right leaning folks who simply supported Trump mainly because he was on their side of the line and frankly not an elderly democrat who was a punchline before he became “The Alternative”.

The nut jobs will create problems, the others will complain but not act. Overall the others far outweigh the nut jobs.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#334

Post by anonu »

tshaddox wrote: post #59
brucethemoose2 wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even in the absolute worst case scenario for Trump (he loses and... has a massive fine? Is in jail for a bit?), this is a huge boost to Trump's campaign handed to him on a silver platter. Honestly thats exactly what Democrats want too, as they would rather run against Trump than Desantis or a Never Trumper.

This framing comes up all the time. Is there anything that would…not be good for Trump’s campaign?

No publicity at all.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#335

Post by stuckinhell »

webdood90 wrote: post #194
mbgerring wrote: post #55

Nearly the entire point of the United States at its founding was that the law should apply to political leaders. We are overdue for setting the precedent of a former President being charged with a crime, and we ought to go back and charge a few other former Presidents with crimes while we’re at it.

I'm 100% in support of applying the law to all people. What I don't love is the timing of it. It makes it easily dismissible as political theatre. Wait until after the election.

The vast majority of people understand this is 100% political theater. Some just hope it takes him out of the running from 2024, but the truth is this probably empowers Trump to take 2024.

He's always sold him self as the ultimate "Rebel", and a half assed prosecution on something so minor to the grand scheme of things solidifies it. Human Nature 101 which seems to be something hackernews engineers don't understand as much as I'd like as a manager of many engineering teams.

I really don't understand how he drives his enemies to make so many basic mistakes, but he does.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#336

Post by pyuser583 »

walrus01 wrote: post #71
mbgerring wrote: post #55

Nearly the entire point of the United States at its founding was that the law should apply to political leaders. We are overdue for setting the precedent of a former President being charged with a crime, and we ought to go back and charge a few other former Presidents with crimes while we’re at it.

Meanwhile, adjacent to presidents, Henry Kissinger remains both alive and not charged in any international criminal courts. I think he's literally 99 years old now.

He’s also politically active - supporting conservative organizations in various ways.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#337

Post by webdood90 »

at_a_remove wrote: post #200
webdood90 wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand how anyone can justify this perspective. If a crime is committed, there should be consequences. I don't care who it is or what their status is. Instead of accepting it as status-quo, we should be going after everyone at every level, even more fiercely towards politicians.

Well, a crime doesn't need to have been committed. You just have to find someone in power willing to bring charges. This could very well be the start of a cycle of "when the power shifts, prosecute the last guy for whatever it is you think you can make up." How many shots have they taken at the man so far? Plenty. Should this cycle start, look for it to consume a lot of resources, attention, political willpower, and…

Of all the things we waste tons of time and money on, this is near the top of the list for you?

I simply don't care. They could go after every single former president for the rest of time and I wouldn't lose a minute of sleep over it.

Re: Grand jury votes to indict Donald Trump

#339

Post by arcatech »

thathndude wrote: post #165
edgyquant wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No i think this is a reasonable response. I’ve completely checked out of politics as well after 4 years of trump and two years of a continued culture war.

Same here. Sad thing is that I used to enjoy following politics. Now, I just steer clear entirely. It’s all a farce, both sides. The media needs to stop making Trump relevant so that we all can move on.

He’s the first former President to be indicted. There’s no way for him to not be relevant.
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