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‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

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Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#331

Post by irrational »

atoav wrote: post #291
emtel wrote: post #48

One time, I was driving at night in the Sierra after a storm - roads were covered in snow. It's a drive I've made close to 100 times without incident. Going around a bend, I saw a car in the ditch on the outside of the curve. I stopped the car, put on the hazards, and went to see if there was anyone in the car. As I was about to cross the highway a car come sliding around the bend more or less sideways. I stopped and…

> If anyone would like to explain why that didn't kill me I'm all ears. What kills people is current, not voltage. With AC having your heart beat 50 times a second can also cause you to die hours or even days after receiving a shock, but even that requires enough current to flow and cross your skin resistance. Go to ghe hospital even if you are alive and feel well after an electrical shock! Your heart may have suffer…

> your description of the shock does not sound like a fully fledged 230V 50Hz shock

Do they use 230V in Portugal?

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#332

Post by muffinman26 »

itsmemattchung wrote: post #26

Some tips on where to begin to learn more about nature and survive in the wild? Maybe an REI class? I'm a little embarrassed to admit that should I ever venture out into the wilderness, I would definitely not survive. I lack basic survival skills and nature would eat me alive. That being said, I always admired folks who could go camping for days (or weeks), who could cook up a warm (and edible) meal over a campfire.

My own personal list:

1. Look up the 10 Essentials and learn what they are/how to use them.

2. Search for Wilderness First Aid (2 day) or Wilderness First Responder (10 day) courses in your area. The focus is on how to assess and treat problems after they've occurred, but in the process you'll learn what the potential dangers are and how to avoid them or notice them early. For example, you can get hypothermia at surprisingly high temperatures (50 degrees F) in the right conditions, and some of the symptoms are paradoxical.

3. This one might be a bit controversial, but look up the Boy Scouts of America requirements for tenderfoot, second class, and first class scout. Before kids can start earning badges, the Boy Scouts require them to learn a fairly rigorous and comprehensive set of skills in order to not die in the process (first aid, camping, starting a fire and camp cooking, navigation, knot tying, swimming, etc., as well as some ideological requirements that you can skip). Some of these, like what to do when you're lost, you can learn from books or YouTube videos targeted to scouts. For others, you'll at least know what you don't know and the right words to look up to find classes. For example, searching for 'map skills' might not find what you're looking for, but there may be an 'orienteering' club in your area.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#333

Post by petsfed »

wcarron wrote: post #261

I would like to say that I'm generally a pretty experienced outdoorsman. I camp, hike, backpack, snowshoe, boulder,sport climb, used to snowboard extensively and do whitewater rafting. I've summitted Mt. Washington, NH in late October, done plenty of hikes from Death Valley and the Mojave to Sequoia NP, to the bright angel trail, etc. Enough to say I've got some experience, and done my fair share of risky stuff. Most…

>Sadly, these are mostly types of common sense. The lack thereof is the real issue, not ones experience level.

I've spent a lot of time teaching rock climbing, and just about every aspect thereof. Something I saw again and again is that what I understood to be "common sense" was simply that which I had forgotten learning. Autobelay accidents are a really good illustration of this: the most important safety check is to confirm you're clipped to the lanyard by tugging on it, before you leave the ground. Verifying that your safety system works as expected is perhaps the most crucial of the safety practices taught in the basic belay class, and yet, noted guidebook author Rob Kelman had a pretty serious autobelay accident, after climbing for 40 some-odd years prior. He actually lectured me about how safety-minded he was, a year or two before that accident. I read about a rappel accident in Wyoming last year that would've been entirely prevented by backing up the rotten old rappel slings, and the victim never even mentioned checking said slings before trusting them. That's not an absence of "common sense", that's having too high an opinion of your own abilities. I've personally witnessed several climbing accidents, and the unifying factor was that the victims were people whose training and experience (in their minds at any rate) should have rendered them impervious to situations like what they had just landed in (frequently violently).

If there's any "common sense" advice I would give to people, it is to not let your guard down in the wild. No amount of training or forethought will let you completely avoid these situations, do not think you are too smart to avoid a bad situation. That's what I got from the article, and it certainly rings true for me.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#334

Post by usefulcat »

weaksauce wrote: post #321
atoav wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If anyone would like to explain why that didn't kill me I'm all ears. What kills people is current, not voltage. With AC having your heart beat 50 times a second can also cause you to die hours or even days after receiving a shock, but even that requires enough current to flow and cross your skin resistance. Go to ghe hospital even if you are alive and feel well after an electrical shock! Your heart may have suffer…

I'd hazard a guess that the person is using 120vac 60Hz instead of 230/50. 120vac is not as dangerous as 230 w.r.t. this kind of accident. I agree that they seem to have only held the fixture with one arm and probably standing on the leg with the arm outstretched or at least biasing weight to that leg to help reach. the current likely didn't go deep and didn't go across the heart. i agree that there wasn't a hard con…

They said it was in Portugal, which is 230v/50hz

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#335

Post by P_I_Staker »

lovehashbrowns wrote: post #318
P_I_Staker wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's worth pointing out that many people go through these experiences and never do anything like that. There's homeless drug addicts that would commit crimes, but never hold someone up at gunpoint... maybe break into a house and run away when there's an intruder, and feel very guilty. At risk of sounding like a conservative (I don't consider myself one), greed, as well as a culture of violence, and wanting to be toug…

Another piece of the puzzle to add to what you've said, is the feeling of helplessness/hopelessness that can get locked in at a young age. When I was growing up, there were a lot of kids that didn't view their future with any kind of optimism. So really, what difference does it make if they go to jail for selling drugs, armed robbery, running from the cops, etc. That's pretty much how I viewed things, except instead…

Oh, yeah. Absolutely. I kinda glossed over that, but that’s part of the poor conditions I mentioned.

You will certainly feel helplessness from time to time. Some people cope worse than others… I could see myself going that route under different conditions.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#336

Post by lairv »

Reading the blog and the comment section as a european, I realise how Europe feels nowhere near as dangerous as natural parks in the US, less extreme weather conditions, mostly no dangerous wildlife and less environment diversity (mostly moutains, no desert)

I've done some hiking and camping in the Alps, and while some surprise thunder had me stop for 30 minutes, there never was sudden storms or weather change which really put me in life threatening situations

I wonder how much of those "Death in ..." stories are about foreigners who misevaluated the landscape and weather differences between their home country and those national park

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#337

Post by Sebb767 »

mcguire wrote: post #312
emtel wrote: post #48

One time, I was driving at night in the Sierra after a storm - roads were covered in snow. It's a drive I've made close to 100 times without incident. Going around a bend, I saw a car in the ditch on the outside of the curve. I stopped the car, put on the hazards, and went to see if there was anyone in the car. As I was about to cross the highway a car come sliding around the bend more or less sideways. I stopped and…

Most things that are incredibly dangerous won't kill you individually. Something incredibly dangerous might kill 10%---one in ten. Years ago, I heard of someone feeding their pets cooked, bone-in chicken. Eating cooked chicken bones is very dangerous, but you can do it for years before that one day that it suddenly isn't safe.

> Eating cooked chicken bones is very dangerous

Why is that?

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#338

Post by saalweachter »

kkielhofner wrote: post #311
shortstuffsushi wrote: post #302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ouch, in a national chain, potential video, potential payment trail... it's too bad that (in my admittedly limited experience), these sorts of things are almost never pursued, because to your point - there's no disincentive to the perpetrators to stop.

Well let’s remember, after my initial experience with the police I didn’t even bother to return the call from the detective who “followed up”. Not having the cooperation of the victim is a guarantee nothing will come of it. Perversely it also probably reinforced the attitude the officers demonstrated - “Knew it, this guy was doing something shady and finally realized he doesn’t want to get in trouble”. I feel bad tha…

> Occasionally my friends will have me tell the story to someone else and we’ll all laugh about it (occasionally to the horror of anyone hearing it for the first time).

"Comedy is tragedy plus time."

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#339

Post by TheRealPomax »

justsocrateasin wrote: post #200

I recently went on a 60 mile gravel bike trip with a rather large group (50 riders) in the PNW. It was ~May of last year, and a freak storm came out of nowhere over the mountain, while we were in a large national forest. We were all wearing shorts (weather was in the 60s), and woefully unprepared as the temperature dropped into the 20s. I had thin gloves with holes in them. The storm dumped sleet on us and we had to…

As someone from the PNW: if you're going on anything beyond a quick trip, pack for literally every type of weather. Never leave without at least a small camelback with a wind breaker, rain pants, and a foil emergency blanket (bonus points for packing a few plastic bags and a roll of tape, because once the heavens open up, you can quickly slip those over your socks and tie them off so your free stay dry even if your shoes soak through. Keeping your feet dry is stupidly important). The PNW is literally rain forest, just not the tropical kind.

Re: ‘That girl is going to get herself killed’ (2022)

#340

Post by mindslight »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #304
joveian wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One thing I learned from reading some stuff on an electician forum years ago is that the actual ground is really not that attractive to household electricity, mostly just to lightning. I recall them mentioning a video of, IIRC, someone connecting a 15A circuit to a metal stake driven several feet into the ground without the circuit breaking. This is also why things like stray voltage shocking cows can happen. I'm gue…

> the actual ground is really not that attractive to household electricity, mostly just to lightning I assume that's because it doesn't form a complete circuit with the electrical substation your power is coming from -- though some power is delivered, perhaps does due to capacitance between the ground and the distribution lines. Note it would be completely different if your power service used single-wire earth return…

The circuit is not back to the substation, but rather your local transformer. There is likely a grounding rod at the pole the transformer is on, and one grounding rod at each of the premises served by the transformer. It's just that resistance of the earth, especially dry earth, is quite high compared to wires.
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