Ruby 3.2.0 is from another dimension

Post by empthought » Fri, Jan 06, 2023, 3:29 AM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #321

empthought wrote: post #313

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No it does not. Ruby has first-class procs. They are not the same thing. It's a fundamental flaw of the language. It's in the Wikipedia page. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First-class_function "The identifier of a regular "function" in Ruby (which is really a method) cannot be used as a value or passed. It must first be retrieved into a Method or Proc object to be used as first-class data. The syntax for calling such…

> Ruby has first-class procs. Procs are functions (at least, they are functionally equivalent to Python functions—as pure OO languages, in both Ruby and Python first-class callable entities are richer than classic functions, even when counting closures as a kind functions and not a separate thing that includes a function, because they can carry metadata besides the environment of a closure.) > It's in the Wikipedia p…

Post by djur » Fri, Jan 06, 2023, 4:24 AM UTC

empthought wrote: post #330

djur wrote: post #326

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> its just syntax sugar for a symbol passed to a #send call This isn't the case. If you override `send` it only affects direct usage of `send`. You can't override method dispatch. You can in some other OO languages but not Ruby. Agreed otherwise. `x.foo` in Python and `x.method(:foo)` in Ruby do the exact same thing -- return a bound method object that can be called. These are both "proxies" in a sense but they're al…

You just gave away the difference right there. x.foo doesn’t “return a bound method object.” It just accesses an attribute and returns the value of that attribute. The attribute can be any Python value. If it’s a callable then it can be called with parens. There is no proxying whatsoever. In contrast x.method(:foo) does do that proxy construction that you describe… because Ruby does not have first-class functions.

   def foo(self):
       print(self)

   class Foo:
       def __init__(self, fn):
           self.foo = fn

   x = Foo(foo)
   x.foo()

Post by 4m1rk » Fri, Jan 06, 2023, 6:04 AM UTC

pjmlp wrote: post #274

skywal_l wrote: post #53

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> * Ruby was created as a personal, hobby project; Python was created while Guido worked in research institutions, and it helped Python gain recognition in academia environment As a data point, I remember interviewing for an internship in a research institution doing some work on medical images around 2002/2003 and the supervisor telling me that Python was the lingua franca in this domain (from a research and POC dev…

While I was at CERN during early 2000's, it was already being used for the build tooling and package management of HLT. Trainings for getting Python skills were a common offering.

Post by robertlagrant » Fri, Jan 06, 2023, 11:48 AM UTC

michaelteter wrote: post #91

samwillis wrote: post #63

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Map/filter are considered inferior in Python to list comprehensions. res = [x**2 for x in range(10) if x != 5]

Before Ruby introduced filter_map: res = (1..10).select { |x| x != 5 }.map { |x| x ** 2 } With filter_map: res = (1..10).filter_map { |x| x ** 2 if x != 5 } In both cases, I think the Ruby solution is more readable. Python list comprehensions invert the subject (data) and the verb (action). You see what will be done before you see what the subject is. I would argue that showing the subject first allows easier code re…

  [x + y for x in range(10) for y in range(5)]

Post by djur » Sat, Jan 07, 2023, 12:00 AM UTC

empthought wrote: post #338

djur wrote: post #333

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> x.foo doesn’t “return a bound method object.” It just accesses an attribute and returns the value of that attribute. The attribute can be any Python value. Python docs, section 3.2, subsection "Callable types". https://docs.python.org/3/reference/datamodel.html#the-stand... x.foo returns an "instance method object", which is a "callable type". Also referred to as a "bound method", the same term that Ruby and JavaSc…

You are studiously missing the point and spamming irrelevant details. Yes, there's a Python "proxy" in your docs but it is syntactically transparent. Proc's proxy is not transparent. me: > If it's a callable then it can be called with parens The docs: > These are the types to which the function call operation (see section Calls) can be applied: True of Python instance method objects. False of Ruby Methods and Procs.…