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The strange case of Britain’s demise

economist.com

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Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#331

Post by pantalaimon »

Adverblessly wrote: post #260
dignick wrote: post #145

Like in the US, democracy in the United Kingdom is faltering. Our first past the post electoral system means the Tories can retain power with a third of the (active) electorate voting for them. Labour believes first past the post serves them well, but it doesn’t, because they would have been leading a coalition government in the last several elections under Proportional Representation. Instead it requires Labour to b…

Here in Israel with proportional representation, every small party has outsized power since every one of them has enough power to vote down the current government by joining hands with the opposition. As a result, decisions that are undesirable by the majority are consistently made. We are currently after an election but before forming a new government and as part of the coalition negotiations the upcoming government…

Is there a minimum quorum a party has to reach before they can enter parliament?

In Germany they need to get at least 5% of the votes. This was introduced because many small parties had made the parliament of the Weimar Republik unstable.

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#332

Post by atchoo »

TapWaterBandit wrote: post #273
akiselev wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There’s only one meme in British politics seen more often than Malcolm Tucker quotes: “It’s Corbyn’s fault!” It’s febrile at this point.

> It’s febrile at this point. Not really sure what you're saying here. Did you mean to use the word "juvenile"?

"Febrile" is basically a UK Politics meme after being used by journos to describe the "atmosphere in Westminster" during each crisis of the week.

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#333

Post by VK538FY »

chimeracoder wrote: post #316
VK538FY wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I understand your point. 'First past the post' may not be ideal for your country. For other countries, it is appreciated despite its inconveniences. Example: Québec. We inherited 'first past the post' from England. The results are obvious: small parties with significant numbers of voters in many ridings don't end up in parliament. But Québec is a rural province with only one city worthy of the name, Montréal, almost…

> But Québec is a rural province with only one city worthy of the name, Montréal, almost half the population of the province. That city has a demography very different to the rest of the province. In a proportional system, the will of the big city would simply sweep away the rural regions that don't have the same weight. People have learnt to accept 'first past the post' and any change would upset the balance that ex…

Sure, I won't argue semantics. I and many others don't want a democracy that relegates us to an anachronistic minority.

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#334

Post by akiselev »

atchoo wrote: post #332
TapWaterBandit wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It’s febrile at this point. Not really sure what you're saying here. Did you mean to use the word "juvenile"?

"Febrile" is basically a UK Politics meme after being used by journos to describe the "atmosphere in Westminster" during each crisis of the week.

It's also a word most people learned thanks to the fictional Malcolm Tucker character in The Thick of It (Season 3, episode 6 when he's yelling at Ben Swain)

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#335

Post by skippyboxedhero »

sega_sai wrote: post #189
skippyboxedhero wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need to find the data yourself. There is no public source that makes this comparison. I have lived in Edinburgh for two decades btw. Most people who work here have absolutely no idea how many homeless people live there (it has been in the thousands for years) because almost none of these people live on the street or have substance abuse problems (and Edinburgh has very effective segregation so the wealthy don't h…

I'm sorry but I call BS on this. You claimed a specific figure 3x. I'm not claiming things are particularly great in Edinburgh, but people on the council's waiting list are not necessarily homeless.

Okay, good. Call BS on your own inability to find answers for yourself. Congrats, you have won.

I did not say everyone on the council waiting list was homeless. I have no idea why you think this because it isn't anything that I said.

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#336

Post by asdadsdad »

prof-dr-ir wrote: post #246
PaulRobinson wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to suggest you take a look at almost everything done in power by George W. Bush, Donald Trump, François Holland, Paul von Hindenburg, Silvio Berlusconi, Brian Cowen, Jair Bolsonaro... the list could go on... and compare and contrast and then ask if this is subjectively a phenomenon truly unique to the UK. Bad leadership of the type you describe has shown itself in every country in the World at some point. th…

I would like to stress that the gap I speak of is not about stupidity or competence in itself; instead it is about being oblivious to one's own incompetence. For example, I think that people like Trump, Berlusconi, Cheney, etc. are not in the same class. They are certainly bad leaders, but largely because they are selfish grifters who care little about their country. On the other hand people like Cameron, Rees-Mogg,…

Sorry, Trump cares little about his country? Say what you want of him, and he definitely has a big ego to say the least, but I can't think of a more patriotic world leader of late than him. In fact, he's rightly aligned with the nationalist trend in politics that Brexit can be argued to take part in. "America first", remember?

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#337

Post by tjpnz »

namdnay wrote: post #161
rsj_hn wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will only hit those nations in the West that succumb to it. Eurasia is doing fine with stable and reliable power, continuing to both increase fossil fuel usage and build out nuclear power at the same time. Africa is ramping up. Latin America is the wild card. Most of the world is going to keep on using fossil fuels, looking at what happened to Europe as an object lesson of becoming so rich that you forget what is…

I don’t see what religion has got to do with it? Europe is hardly the most religious part of the world Maybe Europe is just rich enough to be willing to sacrifice some of that to help others by reducing their emissions (or at least not harm them as much). Maybe Europe feels a certain responsibility, having started emitting carbon in the first place

They're strongly suggesting that climate change is a religious fantasy.

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#338

Post by gjm11 »

ogogmad wrote: post #19
jrsj wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hadn't Starmer already replaced Corbyn by the last election? I don't think you can blame this on him. I don't think he's really the most unpopular element of Labour either. Even after most media was slandering him as an "antisemite" and all that other garbage because neoliberals have captured all of the institutions in the UK.

The accusations were partly based on him cosying up with terrorists, from Hamas, Iran, etc. Is it too much to ask that a candidate for Prime Minister should respect the Rule of Law? There's also his support for Chavez/Maduro, his suicidally naive pacifism which helps the enemy, etc. Oh, and the episode with the mural, where he was too stupid to understand why a picture of fat people with hooked noses oppressing "the…

Downvoted for (1) complaining about downvotes and (2) "you people".

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#339

Post by asdadsdad »

astrange wrote: post #297
908B64B197 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Post 2016 the messaging from most commonwealth countries (UK, Canada, Australia) seemed to be that they were going to be the ones bennefiting from a brain drain of americans leaving the country. Canada was supposed to become an "AI Superpower" and Universities in the UK were supposed to be where innovation was going to happen next due to the perceived hostility of the United States to foreing talent. I recall someone…

I've mainly seen Canada be used to park people there who can't immigrate to the US because the system for that is too backed up. Being in the same timezone as SV is pretty helpful for collaboration.

I think that can be true, but from knowing many people that did take that route, I don't think that's a stable kind of immigration though. i.e. people who do that would rather be in the US but couldn't and are often just waiting around for the right opportunity to go back. Some stay forever, sure, but I think the two countries offer entirely different lives, specially for career-driven people.

Re: The strange case of Britain’s demise

#340

Post by nicoburns »

version_five wrote: post #280
Adverblessly wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here in Israel with proportional representation, every small party has outsized power since every one of them has enough power to vote down the current government by joining hands with the opposition. As a result, decisions that are undesirable by the majority are consistently made. We are currently after an election but before forming a new government and as part of the coalition negotiations the upcoming government…

I subscribe to the idea that the most important aspect of democracy is to be able to kick out the incumbents (and less important is that every opinion gets direct representation). I think for all the challenges in the US, it does this quite well.

The problem you have in the US is that you only have one alternative choice, so if neither choice is good, then you have no recourse
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