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The case for bad coffee (2015)

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Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#331

Post by jen20 »

MAGZine wrote: post #185
hanklazard wrote: post #34

This was a really beautiful post. As for coffee, like many other parts of life (movies, food, and music especially), I find that I like it very good or very bad—as long as it’s not down the middle, I can find a time/place to enjoy it. I have a fairly expensive Rocket Espresso machine, I’ve learned some latte art. I have every coffee making contraption out there. And I enjoy all of it, at times. When I’m in a hurry I’…

starbucks can be good, the trick is to order: 1. espresso drinks 2. order one shot extra (starbucks will only put 1 shot of espresso in an 12oz tall--so you should order AT LEAST one extra shot). 3. ask for blonde roast, which is actually not half bad. pike place/standard is a disaster. it will not parallel any craft coffee shop, but this actually makes for drinkable coffee, which is convenient since there are starbu…

The best thing about Starbucks from my perspective is it gives you somewhere in most cities/towns where you can order tea that isn’t horrible.

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#332

Post by eloisius »

hammyhavoc wrote: post #238
slothtrop wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Starbucks coffee tastes like battery acid.

Here in the UK, I'd say Starbucks tastes of nothing. Hot brown drink. Their ground bags you can buy and take home are equally a non-event. Not sure why people rave about it. Coffee is some of the worst I've had, not withstanding UK McDonald's.

Given the choice, I'll actually get a small cup of black coffee from McD's anytime. At least it's only a couple dollars.

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#333

Post by quickthrower2 »

sershe wrote: post #234
ryanSrich wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean people can drink coffee however they want, but dark roasting beans absolutely destroys the majority of flavors within the bean. There’s no denying that. It’s similar to eating a steak well done. People do it, and it’s even very common in certain countries. But it’s removing the majority of flavor. I don’t see how anyone could deny that.

Or you could argue it eliminates the flavor that needs to be eliminated; using your steak analogy from a sibling comment, drinking medium/light roast may be like eating the steak raw or frozen. Totally different flavor from medium-rare, just not the one many people want. I recently had an unwitting encounter with medium roast (at the same "semi-fancy" price point as I typically buy) when my wife put some fresh beans…

I find the light roasts interesting as opposed to enjoyable. I had one that tasted like orange juice (not as in “notes”, like actual juice!).

Medium is my comfort zone though!

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#334

Post by doublepg23 »

robocat wrote: post #297
codefreeordie wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's actually kind of funny, because I've noticed that there is one little coffee subculture in America that is big on dark roasts -- you'll find a pretty decent variety of dark roasts at the right-wing-political coffee roasteries. I'm not sure how we turned coffee roast level into a partisan political issue, but somehow we did.

Wow - as a New Zealander that almost sounds reasonable. Any other food splits: White-wine versus red-wine? Chicken versus steak? Ice cubes or warm water in Scotch whiskey? Types of distilled alcohol? Etcetera?

I say whisk(e)y of any type lean towards the right, wine is left, steak can be a unifier, but chicken might get you called "soy".

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#335

Post by jen20 »

ethbr0 wrote: post #63
hanklazard wrote: post #34

This was a really beautiful post. As for coffee, like many other parts of life (movies, food, and music especially), I find that I like it very good or very bad—as long as it’s not down the middle, I can find a time/place to enjoy it. I have a fairly expensive Rocket Espresso machine, I’ve learned some latte art. I have every coffee making contraption out there. And I enjoy all of it, at times. When I’m in a hurry I’…

Well put. Starbucks has become the LongHorn of coffee: once super-local quality, now a thin gruel of mediocrity with fancy branding. And in the process they've wiped out most independent coffee shops.

Have they? As far as I can tell there are now vastly more craft coffee shops than there ever were.

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#336

Post by doublepg23 »

bee_rider wrote: post #286
codefreeordie wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's actually kind of funny, because I've noticed that there is one little coffee subculture in America that is big on dark roasts -- you'll find a pretty decent variety of dark roasts at the right-wing-political coffee roasteries. I'm not sure how we turned coffee roast level into a partisan political issue, but somehow we did.

There are right wing political coffee roasteries?

I believe https://www.blackriflecoffee.com/ is the biggest, though I believe there was drama surrounding them.

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#337

Post by codefreeordie »

bee_rider wrote: post #286
codefreeordie wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's actually kind of funny, because I've noticed that there is one little coffee subculture in America that is big on dark roasts -- you'll find a pretty decent variety of dark roasts at the right-wing-political coffee roasteries. I'm not sure how we turned coffee roast level into a partisan political issue, but somehow we did.

There are right wing political coffee roasteries?

Surprisingly, yes.

"Mainstream" ones like Black Rifle Coffee (which is trying to lose its political image and focus on being coffee for our military, now that it is big wants to be able to keep growing by "selling across the aisle")

But also a whole range of farther-right ones -- Liberty Coffee is one, Stocking Mill Coffee made a bit of a name for itself by commenting over the Kyle Rittenhouse controversy, Thrasher Coffee is another, and then there are a bunch more I can't remember the name of that make a "1776" or gun-themed roasts.

I've tried some of them -- like I said, they have dark roasts. Some are kinda trash and are clearly just trying to trade on the backlash against liberal coffee, others have pretty tasty dark roasts.

I just find it fascinating how dark-roast-focused the right-wing coffee scene is and how ultra-light-roast the left-wing coffee scene is these days.

I personally find "food partisanship" in America generally to be a fascinating topic, so I tend to go out of my way to experience some of the "controversy"

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#338

Post by analog31 »

zeta0134 wrote: post #326
staticautomatic wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This isn’t directed at you/OP, but the anti dark roast thing seems to me to be a distinctively American coffee snob hipster thing. Many places in the world have wonderful dark roast coffee. Honestly, are these people just wandering around Austria, Italy, Vietnam, Cuba, or Turkey complaining about bad the coffee is? Give me a break.

I think a lot of this sentiment comes from one dark roast in particular: whatever Starbucks brews has the nastiest, most bitter after taste. It's probably the perfect blend to compliment their sugary concoctions, since there's no mistaking the strong flavor it adds, but it's (subjectively) quite awful on its own. I find dark roasts from nearly any other brand to be more tolerable, with all sorts of interesting flavor…

I remember when Starbucks just began to branch out of Seattle... people went gaa-gaa over it. A grad school buddy of mine was so honored when Starbucks brought a franchise to his town. Today it's reviled. I doubt the coffee is any different, but it's become too commonplace to possibly be good.

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#339

Post by BLKNSLVR »

mikehollinger wrote: post #247

I feel the same way about restaurants. I realized a few years ago that I don’t crave Enoteca’s rigatoni; I crave the feeling of unwinding with some friends after a failed attempt at going to an ice cream festival. We were hot. Annoyed. Tired. And had a great time laughing about it at this tiny bistro as the sun set. The food and the restaurant was a setting, and essential, but it was second place behind the social co…

The older I get, the more I find myself a human, rather than the robot I thought was the ideal goal. Positive social interaction outweighs most other factors in any experience.

Doing X may be enjoyable, but doing X with friends can be a memory that last forever.

(Tangentially: emotion is a superpower when wielded correctly, but can also be a devastating weapon when wielded incorrectly. I've always bowed down to logic, but emotion has the unquestionable ability to upstage logic - in any circumstance involving a human anyway).

Re: The case for bad coffee (2015)

#340

Post by civilized »

rfrey wrote: post #263
ryanSrich wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean people can drink coffee however they want, but dark roasting beans absolutely destroys the majority of flavors within the bean. There’s no denying that. It’s similar to eating a steak well done. People do it, and it’s even very common in certain countries. But it’s removing the majority of flavor. I don’t see how anyone could deny that.

It's not undeniable. Dark roasts are much more difficult to get right and be consistent with. Many roasters can't do it, so they're happy to promote the idea that people who like dark roasts are coffee dilettantes. To me, it's similar to how so many American microbreweries go crazy with hops.

> To me, it's similar to how so many American microbreweries go crazy with hops.

Every "hopocalypse" type beer is utterly forgettable. It's like when you go to some tourist-y small town in the Midwestern US and the gift shop has five hundred different INSANELY HOT SAUCES no one's heard of.

I guess "hoppy" is a powerful, accessible flavor that anyone can easily make, like squeezing a bottle of Sriracha onto some noodles.

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