Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome • Hacker News Board

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

#331

Post by Emanation » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 2:18 PM UTC

texuf wrote: post #264

lhorie wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an unpopular opinion: this whole thing about impostor syndrome honestly seems like a thinly veiled humble brag. The narrative seems to be "nobody's perfect, but I am aware that I have imperfections so brownie points for me". IMHO, there's no real correlation between confidence and ability. There are extremely capable athletes with terrible ego problems and there are people that legitimately fall into death spi…

I guess anyone can interpret it however they want. If you’re challenging yourself in your career, you will eventually find yourself in a position where you legitimately don’t know what you’re doing, and people are depending on you to figure it out. Early in my career I thrived in these situations, because they mirrored my experiences in college. Later in my career, the problems got bigger and I found myself wondering…

That's not imposter syndrome though. That's fear of failure, self doubt concerning your success of accomplishing some new challenge.

Imposter syndrome would involve feeling like all your past achievements were pure luck, you have no merit, and your collegues were going to find out.

There's nuance to the definition; people use the term like they use the term OCD. Not understanding what it actually means. Vanity.

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

#332

Post by Falling3 » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 2:37 PM UTC

titzer wrote: post #99

rhizome wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it's a more accessible way of saying it.

I don't really agree. I find the long-winded version confusing, and as I am not sure if there is a gotcha somewhere in there, I have to read the whole thing and follow the whole argument. You don't necessarily have to use math symbols, but it really helps to be terse.

Why waste time say lot word when few do trick?

For anyone with even a passing knowledge of symbolic logic, what you provided is clear. But the explanation wouldn't be required for those people who are going to be familiar with that Fallacy anyway. It's for those who aren't aware of it. In that case, the symbolic version is of no help and the longer verbal explanation is important.

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

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Post by awsthro00945 » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 2:46 PM UTC

whimsicalism wrote: post #316

awsthro00945 wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amazon is lower than Google, FB, and Netflix, but still quite a bit higher than MS. According to levels.fyi for engineers all at the same level (~5ish YOE): - MS: $185k - Amazon: $230k - Google: $267k

Don't think those MS numbers are accurate, esp. once you throw in GitHub and LinkedIn.

LinkedIn is definitely higher (dunno about GitHub), but in almost every discussion I've seen about comps, LinkedIn is always talked about separately from MS. On levels.fyi, for example, LinkedIn is in it's own section separate from MS.

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

#334

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 2:47 PM UTC

gavodavo wrote: post #259

armchairhacker wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> good enough to deserve your position What does this mean? What qualifies as "good enough"? If you're not fired, you're good enough for your boss. There are billions of people from poor regions who would put in way more effort than you. Many of them are smarter too. You make $100K / year to spend 35 hours / week drinking coffee and writing JavaScript, they make like $10K / year to spend 60 hours / week physical labo…

So in the end what's important is if you're good enough for _yourself_

[deleted]

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

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Post by stavros » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 3:03 PM UTC

deanCommie wrote: post #77

A lot of the discussion here is treating impostor syndrome and qualifications as binary: You're either qualified or not. And your evaluation of your skills is either above your actual skills or not. But it's more nuanced than that. I'm a Principal Engineer at a FAAMNG company. I have impostor syndrome all the time. Why? Because I measure myself against 1) role models that are ahead of me in many ways - I've always do…

I can't relate with these at all. I realize that most people have an internal measure of "worth", but why? I don't assess myself, in interviews I detail facts about what I've achieved and let others do the assessment themselves. What good does it do to say (or even just feel) that I'm not good enough for a job that someone thinks I'm great for?

I just do my best and hope that's enough. If not, they can always fire me. Why worry about it?

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

#336

Post by stavros » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 3:09 PM UTC

labster wrote: post #309

polote wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question, imagine if at your company tomorrow they decide to fire one principal engineer. Would you find it fair that the one is you? Would yo find it fair if you were among the 10% they fire? The 20%? The 30%? I ask you that because it is much simpler to answer to a binary question like, do I have imposter syndrome? Or put in other words, am I modest? You can make the link with how people see themselves. A lo…

I went ahead and did the experiment: I felt like I was contributing nothing of value at my last job after seven years and just slowed things down, so I ended up giving 5 weeks notice. My employer agreed I was useless and decided to turn that into 9 days notice. The result: they are even further behind than they were with me, and occasionally people still contact me from the old company for tech advice. I guess it was…

> My employer agreed I was useless and decided to turn that into 9 days notice.

Did they say you were useless and changed the notice to 9 days, or are you inferring the former from the latter?

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

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Post by chinchilla2020 » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 3:10 PM UTC

sb52191 wrote: post #165

RIDDLERTHIS wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think I agree with your description. I'm currently sitting on three job offers - I originally thought it would be easy to choose, but I find myself absolutely paralyzed right now with an inability to make a decision on any of them because I feel as though I will be expected to know more than I think I know, or to perform at a level beyond what I feel comfortable performing at. I've had a lot of great feedback from…

It's your job in interviews to accurately describe your abilities and talents. It's the company's job to determine if that's the right fit for them. If they sent you an offer, I'd just assume I don't have a clear enough picture on what they will expect of me and when, and just trust that they did their due diligence in my evaluation. Of course, if it doesn't work out, you had three offers so you'll likely be able to…

Expectations and company culture can be difficult to communicate during an interview. Sometimes the interviewer doesn't even realize what would be relevant to the jobseeker.

If the company fails their 'job', you end up with the black mark of a missing block of time on your resume, plus the major hassle of switching jobs and re-interviewing. It isn't "No problem" as you say. It's a major problem that could set you back by months.

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

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Post by pmdulaney » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 3:18 PM UTC

So, if she weighs the same as a duck... she's a WITCH!

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

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Post by no-s » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 3:24 PM UTC

deanCommie wrote: post #274

agumonkey wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in a strange position. I'm burnt out on every side of every candles from trying too hard too long with no results (due to life chaos, lack of luck, bad choices, who knows). To survive I took brainless jobs and I find myself in a different form of pain, being eroded by uneducated, learning-resistant cogs. Right now reading you say "measuring my self against people ahead of me" feels tempting, even after all the pr…

re: PPS. More than you know, but going into detail about my weird and unorthodox working style would reveal too much personal info. re: PS. I should clarify. I was a damn good programmer who could pump out clean, readable, maintainable code, faster than most. But only once I found myself in a job I loved surrounded by people who encouraged learning, were curious, and loved to teach me. You gotta find your tribe. Don'…

> But only once I found myself in a job I loved surrounded by people who encouraged learning, were curious, and loved to teach me. You gotta find your tribe. Don't let your brain rot.

I have a corollary: badly managed companies make good people go bad.

Even worse is the delusion where you believe awareness of bad influences protects you from the consequences...some things can not be mitigated. For example “the culture of mediocrity” :https://www.researchgate.net/publication/257623179_The_Cultu...>.

Re: Actual impostors don't get impostor syndrome

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Post by Kluny » Thu, Aug 12, 2021, 3:34 PM UTC

saalweachter wrote: post #144

Kluny wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lmao, had the same thought. Also, did you get a lot of those participation trophies when you were a kid? I read a take on those recently, along the lines of, "if the adults always praise everyone, then their praise is meaningless and can't be trusted". Ie, a recipe for impostor syndrome in later life. I certainly experience that. Anytime I participate in an activity that I'm naturally talented at, I figure it's just…

Participation trophies weren't a big thing for GenX or Millennials, according to Google's N-gram Viewer, showing up instead for Boomers and Zoomers (and the Silent Generation). https://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=participation+...

Did OP mention their age? I assumed, without any other info to go with, that they're about the same age as me - 30's and millennial. And my cohort got participation medals for every goddam thing you could think of. Looking at the 6th place ribbon winner of the third grade spoon race right here.

Not to pick nits or anything!