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TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

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331–340 of 511 posts

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#331
post #276
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Australia is a relatively small market located far from global supply chains Australia is also the world's second largest exporter of rare earth metals. It does, in fact, have a considerable part of the raw materials required for fabrication already being extracted in-nation. It would not take much for Australia to insert itself into that global supply chain, as a more reliable and stable political environment than…

Define “not much”. The idea sounds nice but how do you execute on it? Should Australia tax or ban rare earth exports to try to force value add industries here? That would go against our position as a stable supplier and would seem more likely just to make customers source their rare earth supplies elsewhere (they’re not that rare).

> Should Australia tax or ban rare earth exports to try to force value add industries here?

You're right that doing so would appear to be a hamfisted approach to creating a homegrown economy that is attractive to industry, and would likely be doomed to failure.

Rather than trying to browbeat the industry into slowing exports, provide the opportunities for using the materials here, within the nation. That is done by providing a less-costly way of turning a profit. Less transportation, etc.

This is done by projects that would consume those resources. Government-led infrastructure investment projects can be successful, such as the Snowy Hydro project which was delivered under-time, under-budget, and over-performing expectations.

We don't need to tax or ban anything. We can invest in creating existing technologies here in Australia... Rather than investing in pipedream technologies that don't yet exist like the carbon sequestration investments that were just announced.

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My point is that if you already successfully operate several seismically stable fabs and you're building a new one that's gonna cost you tens of billions of dollars anyway, there must be other factors that are higher on your requirements list.

Fabs deal with earthquakes by stopping. They'd rather not stop.

This still doesn't make sense to me.

If seismic stability is a top-of-mind problem, why do they keep building new fabs in Taiwan? Why not move to diversify higher-end production sooner?

Why build in Arizona, a state which - while less seismically active than Taiwan - has multiple active faults and regular earthquakes?

It really seems like "a place that's flat and has a relatively low occurrence of natural disasters" is more of a would-be-nice than a must-have.

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#333
post #232

I wonder how significant it is that there is all this worldwide expansion of chip making factories just as we get to 3nm architectures, I say that because there aren’t very many nm’s left, what happens when we get to zero?

I wonder if the end of chip performance improvements could cause a short term boost in manufacturing investment and sales. Instead of chip investments in products and data centers surely becoming obsolete in a few years, useable lifetimes could be measured in decades if the chip designs and performance are not expected to change. If you can get 30 years out of a data center investment instead of 5, you can spend a lo…

[deleted]

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#334

Where does the water come from in Arizona?

Phoenix gets its water from the Salt and Verde Rivers, the Colorado River and ground water (wells). SRP (Salt River Project) manages the Salt and Verde Rivers and CAP (Central Arizona Project) manages the water from the Colorado.

Some interesting data can be drilled into here in the Power BI report: https://new.azwater.gov/ama/ama-data

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#335

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's precisely why. It costs A LOT to make a fab seismic resistant They've done this and know the costs

My point is that if you already successfully operate several seismically stable fabs and you're building a new one that's gonna cost you tens of billions of dollars anyway, there must be other factors that are higher on your requirements list.

If the operation you currently operate is made significantly more complicated to design and run due to seismic issues and you have the opportunity to start from scratch in a location which doesn't have those issues, why wouldn't you?

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#336
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before "nanny state" regulations, food used to be sold in a decomposed or rotten state, it was exposed to all sorts of contamination and merchants mixed it with all sorts of non-food such as wood. Having weird digestive illnesses was very common back in the day, as well as dying from them. Before "nanny state" regulations, you would work as much as your employer wanted you to work, you had no sick days, no vacation,…

That things are better than they were is not particularly strong evidence supporting the “nanny state”. I absolutely agree we are better off now than 100 years ago.

You can never find strong evidence for this. A nanny state is just a state that is "overprotective." How protective something is to the point of being overprotective is completely a matter of opinion. Some people think the US is overprotective some people think it's under protective. It's a matter of opinion as the definition of over protective doesn't have a threshold set.

One thing is for sure though on the exact topics mentioned by the post you replied to. I am glad the United States is highly highly protective on these issues. I want these issues to be nanny'd to death and you do to unless you're down to face the consequences.

Characterizing it as "better off" is just word play. There is definitely more nuance here.

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#337
post #330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Geopolitically this makes a lot of sense. Geopolitically it makes no sense. What exactly do they expect any much changing from thus move other than Samsung getting even more desperate, and Korea possibly moving closer to China if the next Korean president will be a gullible populist (which is now a close probability.) A lion share of high tech manufacturing happens in Taiwan-SK-Japan triangle, all within walking di…

> if the next Korean president will be a gullible populist (which is now a close probability.) Is it? Anti-CCP sentiment is super high in Korea now. And it seems like the right-wing parties are capitalising on that.

The right is also pro-business. Lowering heat on China in exchange for concessions for Korean business is what I am afraid.

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#338
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If I remember correctly, ones Rupert Murdoch famously said that it’s impossible to find a phone number to call. Do the HN rules of assuming good faith apply to him as well? /s https://europa.eu/european-union/contact/call-us_en Please don't signal boost easily falsifiable claims like this. The function of it is to sow division and prevent proper nuanced discussion.

>Please don't signal boost easily falsifiable claims like this. The function of it is to sow division and prevent proper nuanced discussion. The phone numbers on that page is a hotline for general questions. It is absolutely not the same thing as the point mrtksn's Murdoch quote mentioned. A media magnate like Murdoch has the phone number to the White House central switchboard and can get the President on the phone.…

If you want EU to do something you can call Angela Merkel, and she can beat EU Parliament and other institutions into submission quite quickly.

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China will do everything it can to keep the factories in a war, it’s likely the US would offer a lot of Taiwanese US visas especially those in tech, it’s likely the Taiwanese people will have a general strike and the whole place will be very unpleasant to live in after probably many hundreds of thousands of Chinese dead due to choke points getting onto the island. It’s likely after an invasion most production for the…

> after probably many hundreds of thousands of Chinese dead due to choke points getting onto the island I wouldn't put it past China to simply flatten the entire island or at least everything surrounding these chokepoints with conventional bombs until submission and genocide whoever remains alive afterwards.

They want the island as much for the people and technology as they do the land. They have plenty of land. The choke points can be bombed from anywhere on the island and even from cruise missiles.

Re: TSMC looks to double down on U.S. chip factories as talks in Europe falter

#340
The Nikkei has a detailed article [0] on the steps that China is taking to compete with TSMC and other western chip factories. I think a lot of commenters would be meaningful if they took time to read the other side of the problem and not just run into nationalist and inflammatory war.

[0] https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/The-Big-Story/US-China-tec...

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