Earlier quoted context omitted.
None of us can see the future. I first got into bitcoin in early 2011. I have no rational evidence to support this, but my intuition tells me that bitcoin cash will not be the winner. Too much hassle to adopt, few exchanges currently supporting it.
but BCH/BCC is more like BTC was designed to be (everything is in the blockchain)... What is the hassle? more HDD space used up?
Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
331–340 of 429 posts
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#332Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, what I'm saying is by refusing to allow withdrawal of the "new" coins, they put themselves in the position to be sued because clients lose potentially a lot of free money. It's an opportunity cost: if I missed out on some big trades while the price was high due to their decision to withhold the keys, I'm rightfully annoyed by it. Of course leaving legality out of it, it'd also just be a smart thing to do because…
> No, what I'm saying is by refusing to allow withdrawal of the "new" coins, they put themselves in the position to be sued because clients lose potentially a lot of free money. Coinbase is a company that handles people's Bitcoin (and a couple other currencies). Coinbase never made any promises to support other currencies that copy Bitcoin's balances or are otherwise awarded to Bitcoin users. Bitcoin Cash isn't menti…
I get what you're saying but it doesn't really matter. If they don't want to lose a lot of customers (and revenue) they'll offer a withdrawal option.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#333Earlier quoted context omitted.
As one of the btc nouveaux rich, help me understand something I see reoccurring among my other btc-rich friends. Generally, when you're up big (and in some cases extremely wealthy), you diversify your investments in order to preserver your wealth. However, almost without exception my btc friends are such believers that they are holding on for the ride forever. Is it just that the risk-averse were initially drawn to b…
> is it a matter of principle to hold forever? There was a reply to this, now deleted: > this is a pretty common (and self-destructive) phenomenon amongst unsophisticated investors On the contrary, it's much more common for unsophisticated investors to sell their winners too early. Dumb money is more emotional. Dumb money is risk averse and can't tolerate losses, so holds on to losers forever. Dumb money harvests win…
Dumb money invests emotionally without comprehending why a thing is traded for other things.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#334Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Coinbase can do anything they want! That's no how laws work. Not even remotely. Thankfully. Consider you order somebody (X) to transport your pregnant cow. At the destination the cow arrives. It's not pregnant anymore and X refuses to give you the calf because... well, because he can do anything he wants. That's theft.
The difference is Coinbase clearly announced their position that they will NOT honour Bitcoin Cash ahead of time https://blog.coinbase.com/update-for-customers-with-bitcoin-... Basically, they said "if your pregnant cow gives birth, we will not give you the calf. If you want your calf, take your cow away from Coinbase and keep it on your own pasture!" And their customers heard it, said ok I'll keep the cow with you,…
So for Coinbase customers not tracking the fork news, this was a total blindside. This gives you 3 days to get all your coins out?
Not to mention if you used the "Coinbase Vault" your coins are subject to a 48 hour holding period before you can them into a usable Wallet. Then you have to wait for what was at some points an 8 hour transaction delay?
Also you need to figure out how securely set up a wallet, potentially order wallet hardware, etc.
No court would say that was sufficient notice.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#335Coinbase is in a bad situation here. If they set a precedent that all BTC forks will be available to their users, then they open themselves to some pretty obvious DOS attacks. 10 new "bitcoins" could fork every day. Are we really going to expect coinbase to support them all? That's absurd. I think it's pretty obvious that they're going to just issue the BCH to people eventually. Here's another thought experiment: I a…
As one of the btc nouveaux rich, help me understand something I see reoccurring among my other btc-rich friends. Generally, when you're up big (and in some cases extremely wealthy), you diversify your investments in order to preserver your wealth. However, almost without exception my btc friends are such believers that they are holding on for the ride forever. Is it just that the risk-averse were initially drawn to b…
That's the idea.
However, you have to understand that if say SNAP stocks made someone rich, then diversifying makes sense, but if you got rich by some investment in some company Cayman Islands (but with a real business model), then you wouldn't just bring back the money or part of it purely for the sake of diversification.
In other words, diversification away from bitcoin isn't in the same boat as diversifying away from real estate or some stock.
From your friend's perspective, if they sell $100K worth of bitcoin, then is it possible that they might end getting on the radar of the govt and could be on hook for more than $100K?
In addition to that, bitcoiners also believe that bitcoin hasn't reached it's peak, so when it reaches it's peak, they wouldn't have to sell their bitcoins (because every business would accept bitcoin). You don't even have to go to 'every business' part. Even if half of the businesses accept bitcoin, then they don't need to sell their bitcoins.
Finally, if your nouveaux rich friends expect a Venezuala style situation, then, holding it further is the rational choice from their perspective.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#336Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, this is the iPad division quitting en masse and starting their own company together. You don't get shares in that.
Okay let's bring this metaphor back around. This is the iPad division quitting and issuing 'iPad' stock to all current owners of Apple stock. But your broker, who is holding your Apple stock on your behalf, is preventing you from collecting your new iPad stock.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#337Earlier quoted context omitted.
... Giving a few days to do it. Ignoring withdrawal limits the customers cannot raise.
Customers could have sold their BTC for USD at any time and just held USD until after the fork. There isn't any functional difference between holding USD pre-fork or holding both BTC and BCH post-fork.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#338Earlier quoted context omitted.
But there's other cryptocurrencies with a nontrivial market cap out there; Coinbase only supports three. Then there's fiat currency, of which Coinbase's support is also limited. Again, where do they draw the line?
Other cryptocurrencies don't share the original blockchain with bitcoin.
Thousands of other BTC was rewarded to protocol hackers who exploited the empty block rewards and submitted useless "Proof of Work" to the network. Mining pools have also reaped plenty of bitcoins on the "original blockchain" by manipulating their stance as overseers of a vast swath of the mining activity in the network where they could simply prioritize their transactions and rewards over the slaves in their mining pool.
This is not even mentioning the inherent slowness and susceptibility to ASIC attacks, and overall antiquated design of both BTC and BCC network designs.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#339Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Regardless of the price, an exchange cannot seize customer assets by giving them 10 days notice for withdrawal. Perhaps, but the legal question is whether a protocol fork as a matter of law creates a new asset owned by the customer, creates a new asset owned by whoever controls the wallet keys, or merely creates an opportunity which someone who controls wallet keys may exploit to generate a new asset by participati…
While I'm sure that a lawyer can spin in circles arguing semantics over what is bitcoin , the stance that the SEC has taken is that cryptocurrencies are commodity-assets, and therefore any derived assets (forks, etc) are the property of the asset owner.
Re: Bitcoin Cash Soars to $700, Coinbase Customers Threaten to Sue
#340Earlier quoted context omitted.
Other cryptocurrencies don't share the original blockchain with bitcoin.
Which is better because the original blockchain rewarded the majority of bitcoins to very low difficulty early adopters running nothing more then a 3GHz CPU. Why would you want to keep an old blockchain and keep raising the difficulty? Why not keep the difficulty high and announce the date of the new chain without premining? Because it's a ponzi scheme, and it's easy to hide behind the technical jargon and hype propa…
As I explained, the reason Bitcoin Cash situation is different is because the blockchain / private keys are shared. It's not the case with the altcoins. That's why Coinbase is in the wrong.
Plus it would cost them very little to fix the situation, compared to how much of the users' money they are holding.