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Solar Roof

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Re: Solar Roof

#331

Post by tren »

dbecker wrote: post #146
blakesterz wrote: post #2

Yikes. I just signed a contract for a new roof here last month, it's going to cost about $12k. Just did the estimate for the Tesla Solar roof... $80,300, so $87k if I want the battery too. I can barely afford the $12 right now, the $80 is just so far over it's not even close, even with how much I save over the years in electricity. That being said, I love these things, so hoping it gets cheaper in the coming years.

The $80k roof is especially scary if you live in an area with any type of natural disaster risk. The area I live in just had a huge hail storm. Most roofs in our neighborhood will require repairs. That's a bummer with asphalt shingles, but it would be a lot worse with an $80k roof. Most people won't think about those risks, but over the time period you need to consider for a roof, it's a big risk in most places.

Elon posted a huge hail cannonball hitting a roof tile: https://www.instagram.com/p/BT7HVS3AZ4q/. It looks pretty resilient.

Re: Solar Roof

#332

Post by vkou »

sbov wrote: post #170
vkou wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Batteries + roof PV, is far more expensive on a per-watt basis, then a power grid + utility-scale generation. "Just buy a $15,000 PowerWall, which you will need to replace every 10 years" is, compared to grid electricity, incredibly wasteful. There's a reason why customers and users overwhelmingly prefer centralization, even if its harmful for them in the long-term. It's cheaper, and people would prefer it to be some…

Have you done the math? If net metering didn't exist, my back-of-the-envelope calculations say it would probably break even in California. With net metering, sure, it's pointless.

My parents pay $1,200/year for electricity, in a fairly large house. Given the expected lifetime of a power wall, that will eat all the 'savings' of living off the grid.

There's also the matter that if, say, 40% of the population disconnects itself from the grid, that doesn't mean that the cost of maintaining that infrastructure will drop by 60%. Someone will have to pay for it.

Re: Solar Roof

#333

Post by sliken »

IvanK_net wrote: post #45

I have always been a huge fan of a quick transition to sustainable energy sources. There is just one little thing I don't understand. Why they expect people to make electricity at their homes? You can buy a little piece of land in a dessert, put solar panels there and distribute the electricity to other places. And you don't have to climb on any roof during the installation or the maintenance. It is not profitable to…

Well there's a bunch of factors. Energy distribution is not free or perfectly efficient. You are also doubling the footprint of the house+solar and land (nor it's ecological impact) are free.

Additional solar power absorbs sunlight and produces electricity. One benefit is that the house under it is cooler and needs less air conditioning as a result.

Also balancing the energy infrastructure for a state/country with significant solar/wind sources adds significant new complexity for the power grid. It's definitely most efficient to keep your homes power use off the grid as much as possible.

Additionally at least in California peak power use is air conditioning related and follows a power use curve pretty similar to solar production. So the hottest days/times have the most power generation (there's some lag). This allows the state to minimize power production only for those worst case days in late summer, which is the most expensive (power, cost, and environmental impact) power plant.

Power plants can be quite efficient if utilized 100%, but the difference between minimum power and maximum power needs can create huge inefficiencies where solar can help.

I'd also argue that adding distributed power use makes the grid overall much more robust. Earthquakes, major storms, attacks against infrastructure, etc are all less of an issue if a decent fraction of houses produce most of the power you need.

Re: Solar Roof

#334

Post by 467568985476 »

sliken wrote: post #327
carleverett wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with the sentiment, but I have to correct your idea that global warming is a species-ending problem. The worst-case scenario of global warming (which might be inevitable given the current CO2 levels) is a 216 foot rise in sea level [1]. This will cause mass migration and be extremely expensive and unpleasant for society as a whole, but poses little threat of ending humanity. NASA's JPL did a great lecture a f…

You are looking at a very small fraction of the problem. Yes higher water is not an extinction level event. But with increased CO2 there's also increasing acidification. So the plankton dies, coral dies, mollusks die (their shells erode). The food web at sea dies.... as does the food for a decent fraction of the planet. Acid rain causes more damage, food production becomes tougher... especially on the decreasing numb…

There is a great book by a marine biologist that goes into detail about these topics. It's called The Ocean of Life - The Fate of Man and the Sea by Callum Roberts. It was recommended to me here on HN several years ago, and I think that recommendation bears repeating. He goes into great detail about conservation topics for half the book, and the other half has to do with climate change and its effects on the oceans (and how that affects humanity).

Re: Solar Roof

#335

Post by yeukhon »

> Installations will start in June, beginning with California

Would be interested in NYC.

So a couple questions for those already done this:

* any tax benefit / government subsidies I should be aware of?

* starting small, recommendation? pricing?

Re: Solar Roof

#336

Post by omegaworks »

obastani wrote: post #305
brandon272 wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's unfortunate that people can't see that junior dealing with the effects of climate change in 30, 40, 50 years could be a lot more devastating to his life than the prestige level of his preschool.

It's a classic case of prisoners' dilemma. Taking your kid out of daycare isn't going to help the planet very much, but could hurt your kid a lot.

Why does there need to be "the best" preschool. Can't we have a society with standards? A society that gives a damn about iniquity?

Re: Solar Roof

#337

Post by sliken »

euyyn wrote: post #125
mrfusion wrote: post #14

how these shingles connect to each other? And how are they affixed to the roof? You can't just nail them right?

That's what baffles me about this whole thing. Unless your roof is rectangular with homogeneous shadows, if you connect the shingles, say, in rows, you'll have unbalanced voltages. Is the plan to have a microinverter per row of shingles?

There's two types of tiles. I suspect they just use the same number or row and then fill in any gaps with the non-solar tiles.

Re: Solar Roof

#338

Post by xj9 »

Retric wrote: post #295
rhino369 wrote: post #257

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. Even RCP8.0 wouldn't lead to extinction of the human race.

Does that include the increased risks of nuclear war, new disease vectors etc? Because, while the probable outcome is relatively little impact the butterfly effect means you can get some less predictable results indirectly. Aka migration causes war X which due to _ spiraled into WWIII. Granted the world without global warming could alos end randomly as well so you can just say unknown unknowns are always a risk even…

increased risks of nuclear war

you do realize that initiating nuclear war is suicide, right? the u.s. took advantage of the only chance of actually using one because they were the only nuclear power at the time.

Re: Solar Roof

#339

Post by sliken »

OrthoMetaPara wrote: post #245

This is the dumbest thing ever. If you live in a city or a suburb, you don't need one of these things because you'll be connected to a grid that can give you electricity that is far more efficiently generated. If you live in a rural area with a lot of sun, then you can just put solar panels on the ground where they're not a bitch to clean. I'm not against using solar electricity because it can be made affordable but…

Most grid power is not solar. So running local solar can save you money, cool off your house (cool attic in the shade of the solar), and decrease your peak load on the power grid which makes the grid more efficient.

Even in rural areas while cheaper to mount on the ground, you lose the savings of a cooler house.

Re: Solar Roof

#340

Post by gremlinsinc »

omegaworks wrote: post #336
obastani wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a classic case of prisoners' dilemma. Taking your kid out of daycare isn't going to help the planet very much, but could hurt your kid a lot.

Why does there need to be "the best" preschool. Can't we have a society with standards? A society that gives a damn about iniquity?

I think you mean inequality...iniquity is sin...which society doesn't care much about either lol
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