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Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

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Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#331

Post by jaredhansen »

Glyptodon wrote: post #306

As someone living in working in a medium size city and non-tech-enclave I can tell you that there's very little non-remote SW/web dev work here. There are people who need someone to manage Wordpress or Drupal sites for SMBs, realtors, dentists, and similar. There are also a smattering of java/.Net nightmare jobs in companies that are non-tech-centric or defense related. There are exceptions, but you might come across…

>Rather, I think you probably need the connections from a tech-enclave

As a tech employer who has consistently hired from "non-tech-enclaves", here are some practical tips that may help people in your position "swing high-paying remote work":

- Have a public presence: open source, stackoverflow, portfolio on your own site (bonus points for a cool site that itself shows off what you can do), etc.

- Flesh out your profile on AngelList. Many startups do not care where you are so long as you are doing a good job, and there is plenty of room for salary/location arbitrage in between "market for SF Bay" and "way better than I can earn anywhere near where I live".

- Actively look for remote-only stuff.

It's really not about connections. It's about showing that you are a fit for the company doing the hiring. That's why I'm taking the time to respond here -- there is a pernicious meme that "it's all about who you know". This idea is not only false, but harmful, because it encourages defeatism and fatalism among highly skilled individuals who could dramatically improve their own work situation if they were willing to take a few relatively simple steps to do so.

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#332

Post by mahyarm »

russdpale wrote: post #232
seibelj wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm fine with it being hood, I live here after all. But it is nice when things improve.

Dude, there isn't 'hoods' or ghettos in Boston, at least none that I recognize. Plenty of places deep in the south that are much more dangerous.

I wasnt taking about boston specifically.

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#333

Post by Swizec »

ryandrake wrote: post #307
Swizec wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Ok, which of the 3 decent restaurants am i going to today?" Gets really boring after a while. New ones to try open every few years instead of every few weeks. You look at Yelp or similar and you've been to everything it suggests and decided it's meh. Or your friends have been and aay it's kinda meh. There's also that argument that Oatmeal mentioned once. In a small city you have Asian restaurants. Maybe Chinese, Jap…

I don't get this whole hang-up about restaurants. To me, "the number/type of restaurants in the area" is something I don't even consider when deciding if I want to live somewhere. Admittedly I'm not a restaurant guy. I pretty much never go to them. To me, they're just an expensive way to eat food. And they are a pain in that you need to do so much just to "enjoy" the experience. Get dressed up, drive or walk to the p…

> Admittedly I'm not a restaurant guy. I pretty much never go to them

Imagine that, a person who never goes to restaurants doesn't consider them when making decisions. Shocker.

I go maybe once a week. Sometimes twice. And I almost always end up going to the same few. But once in a while I like to try something new and it's great when that option is available.

And I don't know where you eat, but my fav kind of restaurants are in the $20 to $30 per person range. $100 is for special occasions.

Fun fact: in Ljubljana (my home city) you can barely even find $100/person restaurants. So even if you want to special occasion, you can't. And when you do, the food is often closer to a San Francisco $30/person restaurant.

So yeah

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#334

Post by jamie_ca »

zephyrfalcon wrote: post #294

In spite of what the article claims, the vast majority of employers do NOT let you work remotely 100% of the time. They are mostly located in the big/expensive cities, so that's where developers will go. There's really no mystery there.

Yep. Network effects.

Best place to start a business is where you have easy access to a large employee pool for your specialty. Best place to locate yourself as a specialized employee is where your industry concentrates a large number of employers.

This is true if you're in software, finance, film, ....

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#335

Post by jumpkickhit »

pipio21 wrote: post #100

As a company owner where most work is done remotely, I believe it is just education, people have been brainwashed all his life, and it takes time and work to make people operative remotely. Working remotely means you can life whenever you want,not just in cheap places, (in practice anywhere in the US, as living in other countries have political problems like taxes and bureaucracy) L.A or New York, but people are not…

I've worked remotely online since 2000, my preferred way to work.

You should offer training. A problem I see in a lot of businesses is old school thinking.

Some people just think "Business" means dressing up in a suit, having 3 hour meetings daily and making eye contact and shaking hands.

Like it's still the 1920's.

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#336

Post by ryandrake »

JCharante wrote: post #328
ryandrake wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I make good money. Why should I have to live in a cramped city when I can live in a 3000 sq.ft house on 10 acres of land and send my kid to an elementary school that doesn't need metal detectors and armed security guards?"

Surely private schools in SF don't have metal detectors.

Sure, but irrelevant. Who can afford private school for their kids? I bet executive jets offer great convenience and no security lines, but that doesn't have any bearing on my vacation plans.

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#337

Post by FullMtlAlcoholc »

donretag wrote: post #279
FullMtlAlcoholc wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience, I've found the best cycling to be in the LA and SD area....bike aware culture and weather permits you to ride over 300+ days a year. I imagine California in general has great year round cycling

I work remote from central Los Angeles. The biking is incredible here. I mainly do hills and the Santa Monica/San Gabriel mountains provide some excellent climbing. There is very little traffic in the hilly parts of the city.

From central/Downtown LA, you can take Venice all the way to the beach with a dedicated bike lane. I rarely go on trails, as I only have a road bike. My favorite trip is to take the bus to somewhere north of Malibu and ride along the PCH for about 20 miles.

Off-topic, but LA really does have great public transportation. It covers nearly the entire metro area such that you can get pretty much anywhere and only have to trek a few blocks to catch a connecting metro line (whether that be bus, rail, or subway). The problem is you're not going anywhere fast.

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#338

Post by ryandrake »

Anderkent wrote: post #326
ryandrake wrote: post #307

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get this whole hang-up about restaurants. To me, "the number/type of restaurants in the area" is something I don't even consider when deciding if I want to live somewhere. Admittedly I'm not a restaurant guy. I pretty much never go to them. To me, they're just an expensive way to eat food. And they are a pain in that you need to do so much just to "enjoy" the experience. Get dressed up, drive or walk to the p…

People like different things. What a shock! > Same goes for nightclubs, museums, movie theaters, "culture". This is really why people want to live somewhere??? What do you do in the afternoons? Almost every home-hobby I can think of is improved by company of people with similar interests. Rather than do DYI in a garage, I'd rather go to a hackerspace. Rather than play the same N boardgames with the same X people, I'd…

> People like different things. What a shock!

For sure, I get that. I just find it pretty amusing that restaurants, of all things, constantly get brought up in these "Why do engineers move to the city" stories. Anyway, aren't we all working 60-80 hour weeks? Even if I liked restaurants and night clubs, I'd have no opportunity between work and sleep to partake, so it would make no difference whether there were good ones around!

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#339

Post by wordpressdev »

henrikschroder wrote: post #145
rubicon33 wrote: post #38

I used to live in SF. It was exciting, but also shitty. I felt connected and alive, which was great, but also drained of resources, which really sucked. Oh, and there were 6 of us, in a 3 bedroom apartment. I had the living room. Yea. I lasted 3 years, until I met my wife, and by then I was ready to move. We did. Now, life in the suburbs, is slow. I feel somewhat disconnected and like I don't really belong to this co…

> Oh, and there were 6 of us, in a 3 bedroom apartment. This is such a weird American phenomenon, the whole roommate thing. What on earth can make adults choose to share their home with a stranger? Why isn't there intense pressure for building many small apartments, rather than building larger apartments that are meant for roommates? Is it connected to the equally weird college dorm roommate system? Why are people ac…

Most expat workers in Arabian Gulf (GCC) countries live in shared accommodations to cut costs, sometimes 8 people sharing a single room. Life is tough.

Re: Why do developers who could work anywhere flock to the most expensive cities?

#340

Post by conductr »

pm90 wrote: post #296
conductr wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree. Similar thing in all Texas metros. Although expats in Austin are certainly of the CA tech majority. I feel like all of TX is turning into CA.

Well, they do have many things in common: * Warm weather year round * Lots of great universities * Large hispanic population (and immigrants in general) * 2 largest states in the contiguous US The most glaring difference is probably the conservative politics. But that's mostly the rural areas. And the hispanic population may actually help change that. Note: not implying that all hispanic people automatically vote dem…

I've lived in Texas all my ~40 years, all of these things have been true the entire time. The influx of residents over last ~10 years is why I say TX is feeling like CA. It's the ethos. The food. The culture that comes with it. Not a bad thing, just different.

Texas is the friendly state but if I'm being honest there is a part of me that is getting old and cranky and doesn't like it / wishes it could go back to the way it was. However, I totally see the appeal of selling your small expensive CA house and moving to TX to buy a mansion for cash. I'd do the same.

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