I started as an open source programmer. Then I got a job as a .NET programmer. Now I'm an open source programmer again.
Feels good :)
Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
321–330 of 937 posts
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#322Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Does it? Yes. You say you want choice, but if you didn't have a browser how would you download the browser of your choice? Osmosis? Or, more importantly how would your average user download their browser? Every OS since then (OSS or not) has shipped with a browser and has made it the default for any API rendering that needs to occur (e.g. Ubuntu, Android, OS X, Windows, iOS, Firefox OS, etc). Netscape's business mo…
FTP? Wget? Xmodem? Does it even matter? It's not as if downloading a piece of software without a browser is an impossibility. About 99% of the software on the machine I write this on has been downloaded using something called a package manager and the boot CD that started the process was downloaded as a torrent. No browser required. > Netscape's business model would have held the internet back significantly. If Micro…
I think the world is probably a worse place if every computer user was given a command prompt and asked to use wget over FTP to get themselves a web browser. Or worse, if they had to go to Best Buy to buy one on DVD. Like, I can and will make a joke about having to try and put the DVD into the smartphone, but seriously, that sounds worse for pretty much everybody.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#323Well, fuck me and call me Shirley...this is awesome news.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#324I'm glad the new CEO isn't stuck in the 1980s! Props to Microsoft. I hope it isn't too late for them.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#325Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm curious whether, with the fullness of technological hindsight, you still deplore what they did to Netscape. Absolutely. I dislike tied sales, I dislike having to buy a Microsoft operating system with my hardware just as much as I dislike getting IE (or chrome or any other browser) forcefully rammed down my throat when I buy an operating system. I'm pretty sure you can guess what browser I'm using to type this c…
> Does it? Yes. You say you want choice, but if you didn't have a browser how would you download the browser of your choice? Osmosis? Or, more importantly how would your average user download their browser? Every OS since then (OSS or not) has shipped with a browser and has made it the default for any API rendering that needs to occur (e.g. Ubuntu, Android, OS X, Windows, iOS, Firefox OS, etc). Netscape's business mo…
Wrong. Every Window manager has been shipping with a browser, that includes Windows and Apple but also Ubuntu, Fedora, Debian, anything with Gnome/KDE/XFCE.
But there (still!) are plenty of people who start with an empty distro and gradually build up, and installing a browser happens just like any other package installation: through the package manager.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#326Also as part of the announcement clang will get some Visual Studio love!
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#327I'm a hardcore *nix guy but boy do I love me some C#. Up until now it's been the best language I have worked with but the worst platform due to it's lack of 'nice things' that we just expect from languages/ecosystems these days. Where 'nice things' is defined as being open-source, having open-source ecosystem of developer tools etc. This isn't so much the beginning (as good stuff has been happening for a couple of ye…
What languages have you got experience with that you feel C# is the best language you have worked with? And what makes it such a good language for you?
Generics, Partial Classes, awesome Reflection API, Lambda syntax, LINQ, C/C++ compatibility, async/await, concurrency primitives, etc.
I have worked with prettier languages, for instance I have picked up Haskell recently, I have also worked with faster languages, C was my forte for many years and I have worked with languages in the GSD category like Ruby and Python.
C# is appealing not because of some feature that it has that other languages don't. But rather the long list of things they didn't fuck up. For instance by building concurrency and evented programming semantics into the core there isn't multiple competing event loops for instance. (unlike say Python or Ruby which have about 5 each, Java has more than I can count).
It's not so much there is one single thing that makes C# really nice, it's the whole package.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#328Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't know why you are being down voted. Erik Meijer, a huge .NET contributor who worked at Microsoft (on C# among other things), and was behind the reactive .NET extensions (and also a big Haskell contributor) - he was saying exactly the same thing about Scala vs C# - http://www.infoq.com/presentations/covariance-contravariance... I can also testify as someone who uses Scala on a day to day basis and used C# at wo…
Probably because, A), it was an uncalled-for digression into language wars, and B), now that we're here anyways, a lot of us think the majority of features in scala and Haskell for that matter are fundamentally misguided. My goal is not to write elegant code, but to write the least complex code with the lowest cognitive overhead. TCO, 10x the man-hours in maintenance and all that. If the choice is between having to w…
Understood,
By the way, I do null checks in Scala, may the lord have mercy on my soul. I don't like all the "I'm functional and smarter than you with my higher kind types, Monads and type classes" attitude that a minority of Scala lead figures have given it. Scala is very pragmatic down to earth language that you don't HAVE to abuse, the issue is that some people abused it on some libraries (e.g. with weird operators etc...) and some people are "either all the way functional or I rather die" but I think that if any C# developer would have jumped into Scala, they would have had much better things to say about it, even without using a single "purely functional" aspect of the language.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#329aka "We're actually facing competition from open source now, so we're going to listen to what people have been saying for years. Love us?"
You really need to step back and look at how much Microsoft has already changed under the leadership of Satya Nadella. It does appear that he has a completely different vision of what Microsoft will be in the future compared to what Ballmer had.
I'd say it started long before Satya Nadella became CEO. However it is definitely continuing in the right direction.
Re: Microsoft takes .NET open source and cross-platform
#330Can anyone clarify for me, does this include WPF? I remember I wanted to run a few apps off github on linux and they used WPF, which mono doesn't support. Otherwise mono seemed to run pretty much everything i threw at it. Can someone with .NET experience clarify for me what this will enable that mono doesn't (yet)? In other words, if .net will continue to be riddled with windows only API's I'm not really interested.…
Server side makes more sense. WPF is an UI framework, even it includes WPF, the user experience will be bad just because it looks so differently than native apps.