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Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

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Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#321

Post by misc_closet »

dclowd9901 wrote: post #133

I've tried to figure out a way to say what you've said in this post since I've gotten here, and every time, it's sounded like an indictment on the poor. Brilliant post, and it's criminal that an area so full of brilliant people can be so detached from the most actual problems facing the world, when they're right on the proverbial doorstep.

The lack of compassion, perspective, and empathy in this thread alone is enough to make any idealistic computer geek want to burn down Silicon Valley.

It's fucking shameful that nerds--educated and wealthy people who should know better--have these cruel, regressive attitudes toward the underprivileged.

Shame shame shame. Anyone who isn't ashamed of San Francisco's treatment of the homeless--who isn't ashamed of many of the attitudes displayed in this HN thread--is a horrible monster of a person. A person severely deficient in empathy.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#322

Post by misc_closet »

jaibot wrote: post #227

This seems like a good time to remind everyone that there's a known method for reducing human misery you can do right now. http://www.givewell.org/charities/top-charities Give some money. This won't help the person on your doorstep, but it is probably the best way to convert money into well being. And you can look yourself in the mirror and say that even though the world is quite fucked up, you are doing _something_…

What about using entrepreneurial skills, website design, and internet marketing knowledge like SEO to engage in the political process?

What if Silicon Valley, instead of always lobbying for corporate perks, lobbied for a civilized society and lobbied the government to take care of the underprivileged?

So many people are saying they're powerless to do anything... yet they have a plethora of useful skills that could be employed to create political change. They have money. They have time. They have language skills and influence.

If tech people worked together to create a Star Trek like society, starting in SV, it could be done. The first step would be marketing a plan, attracting allies, and counteracting the Ayn Rand corporate fascist propaganda that has flooded the internet and pop culture.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#323

Post by just2n »

> The cost of living is always increasing, and the flashy money from silicon valley is accelerating the gentrification of SF. rent-control is a last ditch effort to prevent those who grew up here from being displaced, but in return prevents them from being able to move within the city.

In particular, the bit about being prevented from moving within the city.

There are many problems with SF itself. One of which is the homeless population. But that doesn't feel so urgent. After all, what can we do for drug addicts and mentally handicapped people, outside of putting them in institutions? They're better taken care of here than they would be in most places, and those who live on the streets are at least in a moderate climate. It sucks, but it could be a whole lot worse. And every time I see people give them money, I feel compelled to explain to them that the money won't actually help them, but a sandwich might.

This is a visible problem, especially to tourists, which may be why it's so widely talked about. But there are other extreme problems with the city. Consider rent control, which is only barely mentioned in this article. It's actively destroying the city. Most economists agree about the effects of rent control, too, and studies have shown the negative effects to be strikingly similar to many of the problems SF is currently facing (which will only continue to get worse). http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/RentControl.html.

How about we solve this problem before SF is just a business center with 0 housing. Then with all that extra housing, we find a place to take better care of our homeless? It's really hard to put them up when you just don't have the appropriate accommodations for it.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#324

Post by misc_closet »

VMG wrote: post #72
briholt wrote: post #33

The same is true for Los Angeles. I've been in an office building while people were discussing six-figure sums like they were nothing, when outside in the alley below there were literally homeless people in a knife fight over a candy bar.

Do you think they fought because they would starve to death otherwise or because they had mental issues?

Nutrition and mental illness are closely linked.

Lack of healthcare and mental illness are closely linked.

Lack of housing and mental illness are correlated.

Lack of employment opportunities and mental illness are correlated.

You talk like an evil person from the 19th century. Mental illness is not a character defect, it's an illness. It has external causes. Psychologists have found that one way to increase the level of mental illness in society is to raise unemployment through austerity measures and other stupid economic policies that are opposed by most economists yet implemented by neoliberal governments.

Another way to increase general mental illness levels is to stigmatize the mentally ill and treat them as if they have character or moral defects. This causes people with mild depressions, for instance, to sink into major depressions.

Another cause of mental illness is a lack of housing. Putting people on the street causes mental illness.

They aren't poor because they're mentally ill. Just as often, they are mentally ill because they're poor. If they could AFFORD treatment, they could be CURED of their illness.

The issue is poverty straight up. You're a terrible person for implicitly blaming the victims.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#325

Post by misc_closet »

VMG wrote: post #154
misc_closet wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You need a citation to prove that homeless people don't want to be homeless? Silicon Valley has peaked. Idealistic, social-conscience-having nerds take note: This is what happens when you let neoliberalism, Randroidism, and corporate psychopathy infect your tech community. Technology is supposed to be used to create a Star Trek future. Not to spy on everyone as we make their jobs obsolete, drive up their rental costs…

I'm not in silicon valley, but I know people who volunteered in homeless shelters.

So your second hand anecdotes trump literally thousands of statisticians, economists, social workers, and other social scientists who spend their entire lives understanding these issues?

You're so fucking right wing. If academia was politically empowered to implement the scientifically proven methods we could eliminate poverty and homelessness tomorrow, and cut mental illness by 90%.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#326

Post by kpennell »

jaibot wrote: post #227

This seems like a good time to remind everyone that there's a known method for reducing human misery you can do right now. http://www.givewell.org/charities/top-charities Give some money. This won't help the person on your doorstep, but it is probably the best way to convert money into well being. And you can look yourself in the mirror and say that even though the world is quite fucked up, you are doing _something_…

thanks for posting this.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#327

Post by vacri »

LekkoscPiwa wrote: post #280
entropy_ wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had honestly never heard about this before, what does the U.S. pay to countries that have bases in them? Any references? I'm honestly curious

Never heard that there are for example over 50,000 US soldiers in Germany operating military equipment worth billions of USD courtesy of the US tax-payer? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Europe So, any attack on the German soil must result in dead American soldiers. Now, who sane would risk doing so? Yeah, very convenient preaching universal healthcare and welfare for the poor when somebody else pays…

heh, "courtesy of the US taxpayer". What you mean is "put there by the US taxpayer". Germany didn't ask for the US to put military bases everywhere, that just grew out of the victory conditions enforced on it from the loss of the war. It very much serves US interests to have those bases in Germany - the idea that it's all a unicorns-and-rainbows gift from the US is nonsense.

The US with no projected power in Europe? Perhaps go write to your congressperson on that one and see how they respond.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#328

Post by dyno12345 »

melindajb wrote: post #303
dyno12345 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The kids on Haight street just want to bum around – there was that article* that found they could make almost as much money begging as they could at a minimum wage job. Other parts of the city I think have more people that really are drug-addicted or borderline insane * http://blog.priceonomics.com/post/43085729257/the-street-kid...

One of the reasons things are probably better for you is that you take a shuttle no doubt, and are isolated from the day to day reality of life here. True? http://www.lrb.co.uk/v35/n03/rebecca-solnit/diary

No shuttle for me

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#329

Post by vacri »

ekianjo wrote: post #314
onemorepassword wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is no Europe. I can only speak for my country, the Netherlands, and there is no such thing as people not having the personal funds to buy or rent housing. That's why we have minimum wages, social security, rent subsidies and regulated rent. The homeless here are people mostly people with mental health issues that reject or don't respond to treatment. It's by far not a perfect utopian system, but to have people…

Not discussing whether it's right or wrong to think this way, but "decent housing" is certainly not remotely considered as a human right. This may be what most people think nowadays, but it's certainly not written anywhere in most constitutions. This is just your interpretation. Now, not being able to afford housing depends on many factors, it's not just about how much you earn, it's also about the artifical bubbles…

Constitutions for the most part are not about describing human rights. They are about describing the method of governments - who is elected where and how, what authorities they have and so forth. There's usually some flowery preamble at the start about how awesome we all are in country -foo-, but the role of a constitution is generally to describe the structure of government.

Re: Come here and work on hard problems – except the ones on our doorstep

#330

Post by TheAntipodean »

LekkoscPiwa wrote: post #280
entropy_ wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had honestly never heard about this before, what does the U.S. pay to countries that have bases in them? Any references? I'm honestly curious

Never heard that there are for example over 50,000 US soldiers in Germany operating military equipment worth billions of USD courtesy of the US tax-payer? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Army_Europe So, any attack on the German soil must result in dead American soldiers. Now, who sane would risk doing so? Yeah, very convenient preaching universal healthcare and welfare for the poor when somebody else pays…

I don't know what the situation is in Europe but Japan pays a substantial sum to America every year and even had to fund the move of some bases to Guam [1]. Also, American's may run the risk of dying defending a foreign country but in the mean time Japanese are living the risk of rape and murder [2] although the stats are probably on an even keel with the normal murder and rape rate of Japan.

[1] Hardly the best of sources but you can dig deeper if you wish: http://www.japan-press.co.jp/modules/news/index.php?id=2443

[2] https://www.google.com/search?q=us+forces+japan+rape&rlz...

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