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Ghostty is leaving GitHub

mitchellh.com

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Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#321

Post by bsimpson »

layer8 wrote: post #308
_doctor_love wrote: post #267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> would be independent orgs that no longer had to worry about making keep-the-lights-on money It is honestly so shameful that we keep falling for this gambit. It is nothing more than a rank "but this time is different!" Economics is what drives things. It is what drives things in households and it is what drives things in companies. Unless times are truly great or the company is truly forward-looking, promises of fre…

I remember discussions at the time where people predicted that this would certainly happen. If people “keep falling” for it, it’s not the same people. And Microsoft certainly wasn’t (and isn’t) a company you’d trust for such statements.

Satya got his own line of "maybe Microsoft's not evil anymore" press cycles out of it.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#322

Post by darkteflon »

Copilot showing up unbidden on my PRs was the final straw for me. Well, actually, the final straw was not being able to figure out how to turn it off.

We all saw this coming when the Microsoft acquisition happened. They constitutionally can’t not fuck their products up.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#323

Post by phillipcarter »

margalabargala wrote: post #319
idan wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hi there! Longtime fan and hubber here. It's okay to have emotions. I have similar emotions. I'm GitHub User 22723 which is effectively the same as you (considering there's ~180m GH accounts nowadays) My version of your post reads differently: "GitHub only gets better if people who give a shit stick around to make it better" Walking away would be easy. I felt that way when I left Heroku ~six years ago. I left that jo…

> "GitHub only gets better if people who give a shit stick around to make it better" This is true but misleading. Unfortunately. It is a true statement for developers working in GitHub at Microsoft. It's not a true statement for users. There is no avenue by which you make GitHub better by continuing to use it as it has been.

Sure it does. Users who continually push for the right features, stress test things (under normal circumstances), demonstrate uses of the platform that could be baked in by default, etc. are all highly valuable to everyone. And the social aspect matters too, even if GitHub really isn't a "social coding" site anymore. If great people doing OSS stuff are all on various GitHub projects, that encourages more good people to do good OSS stuff.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#324

Post by twelvedogs »

nicr_22 wrote: post #298
Yajirobe wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What should we do? The only thing I can think of is to stay vocal about it. Never accept enshittification. Always point things out when they suck.

Focus on open protocols, simple formats over complex vendor-specific cruft. Then you can always "fork" away from an enshittified saas. I bet a small team of the quality of the kind developers who are attracted to hacking on Ghostty could recreate the subset of GitHub functionality they actually need in ~six months. It's just the problem of how to pay for the ongoing care, maintenance and hosting? Maybe another opport…

https://forgejo.org/ already exists, I suspect the issue would be hosting it at scale

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#325

Post by anildash »

mitchellh wrote: post #26

I know this is ridiculously dramatic, but its the truth: I actually cried writing this blog post (tears hit my keyboard, I'm embarrassed to say). Nobody should cry over a SaaS, of all things. But GitHub has meant so much more to me than that (all laid out in the post). I have an unhealthy relationship with it. Its given me so much and I'm so thankful for it. But, it's not what it used to be. I don't know. We've been…

It's good to care about these choices. There are also lots of ethical reasons to leave GitHub, and this makes it easier for people to choose to leave on those grounds, too. Every time people talk about their decisions and normalize anything that's not just having a monoculture where there are no competitive markets and monopolists control entire ecosystems, that's a good thing.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#326

Post by deadfall23 »

mitchellh wrote: post #26

I know this is ridiculously dramatic, but its the truth: I actually cried writing this blog post (tears hit my keyboard, I'm embarrassed to say). Nobody should cry over a SaaS, of all things. But GitHub has meant so much more to me than that (all laid out in the post). I have an unhealthy relationship with it. Its given me so much and I'm so thankful for it. But, it's not what it used to be. I don't know. We've been…

Hey bud, thanks for the honesty and I feel your pain! You're an incredible engineer and I've looked up to you (even though we are the same age) since hanging out at Kiip. Our tools should be getting better not worse. Hopefully your influence can be a canary in the coal mine to make some real change to reliability. -D

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#327

Post by ozim »

mitchellh wrote: post #26

I know this is ridiculously dramatic, but its the truth: I actually cried writing this blog post (tears hit my keyboard, I'm embarrassed to say). Nobody should cry over a SaaS, of all things. But GitHub has meant so much more to me than that (all laid out in the post). I have an unhealthy relationship with it. Its given me so much and I'm so thankful for it. But, it's not what it used to be. I don't know. We've been…

I wasn’t that invested in StackOverflow but still I was quite invested there.

I do feel kind of sadness right now it is a zombie that current owners are just pumping out whatever is left out of it.

I don’t care about GH I felt centralized repositories like that is wrong.

Q/A was supposed to be centralized because we need people to find the questions and answers in a single place.

GH or others should be just referring to repositories not keep them… be a search engine for decentralized repositories.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#328

Post by foresto »

NewJazz wrote: post #114
MarsIronPI wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think a new GitHub will emerge and when it's just right, will grow like wildfire (like OpenClaw, or even GitHub itself did during the SVN and SourceForge era). And many are already trying to be that new GitHub. Really? I can only think of two: Codeberg and Sourceforge. Which are both great, but that's not what I'd call "many".

Gitlab? Three distinct codebases is quite a lot to be honest. Especially when Forgejo has the lineage of Gitea and Gogs in its wake.

Gitlab's interface makes me want to cry every time I have to use it. I would not recommend it to someone who misses classic GitHub. Codeberg/Forgejo/Gitea would be a much better match.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#329

Post by munificent »

DrammBA wrote: post #34
mitchellh wrote: post #26

I know this is ridiculously dramatic, but its the truth: I actually cried writing this blog post (tears hit my keyboard, I'm embarrassed to say). Nobody should cry over a SaaS, of all things. But GitHub has meant so much more to me than that (all laid out in the post). I have an unhealthy relationship with it. Its given me so much and I'm so thankful for it. But, it's not what it used to be. I don't know. We've been…

I can feel the frustation, nothing dramatic about expressing it This quote from the post resonated with me: > I want to get work done and it doesn't want me to get work done. I want to ship software and it doesn't want me to ship software. The sentiment is shared, and github is not the only service making me feel like that, it feels like everything on the web is more flimsy and low quality nowadays. Constant outages,…

> it feels like everything on the web is more flimsy and low quality nowadays.

Not just the web either. It feels like the whole world is in a race to throw shit together and cash out as quickly as possible: influencers, hustle culture, enshittification, etc.

My pet theory is that all of the global chaos around the climate, politics, pandemic, etc. is leading people to no longer believe in the future. Once you lose that, all that's left to care about is the right now. No one takes the time to scrimshaw the deckrails on a ship they believe is sinking.

Re: Ghostty is leaving GitHub

#330

Post by stock_toaster »

idan wrote: post #96
mitchellh wrote: post #26

I know this is ridiculously dramatic, but its the truth: I actually cried writing this blog post (tears hit my keyboard, I'm embarrassed to say). Nobody should cry over a SaaS, of all things. But GitHub has meant so much more to me than that (all laid out in the post). I have an unhealthy relationship with it. Its given me so much and I'm so thankful for it. But, it's not what it used to be. I don't know. We've been…

Hi there! Longtime fan and hubber here. It's okay to have emotions. I have similar emotions. I'm GitHub User 22723 which is effectively the same as you (considering there's ~180m GH accounts nowadays) My version of your post reads differently: "GitHub only gets better if people who give a shit stick around to make it better" Walking away would be easy. I felt that way when I left Heroku ~six years ago. I left that jo…

  > My version of your post reads differently:  
  > "GitHub only gets better if people who give a shit stick around to make it better"
  > Walking away would be easy.
Yeah, be careful not to gaslight yourself into trying to "tough it out" with bad vendor relationships. Sometimes you do need to know when things aren't good/healthy and it is time to walk away, as sticking around just ends up being needlessly flagellent.

Especially with corporate owned software or SaaS ecosystems!

Sounds like you made the right choice with Heroku back in the day. I feel like this is Github's Heroku moment.

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