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Why Japan has such good railways

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Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#321

Post by dullcrisp »

bobthepanda wrote: post #299
dullcrisp wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if it would serve the same population, I don’t think a system like this would have the same level of demand as France’s high speed rail. Frankly, these don’t look like locations that that many people want to travel between.

Most travel happens between cities that are close together, and Chicago has always been the larger gateway to the rest of the nation and the world. The French urban areas on the TGV aren’t very big; Montpelier, for example, has a total of 600,000 people in its metro area, which is roughly the same size as Toledo, OH or Wichita, KS.

Montpellier probably gets more tourism than Toledo though. And most people taking the train to Paris are probably not doing it so they can fly somewhere else.

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#322

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

enaaem wrote: post #245
ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was just thinking about this, this morning. In the US, we have had a pretty wide-open nation, for much of our history. Population density was low, and many folks were forced to be extremely self-sufficient. This has resulted in a fiercely independent national zeitgeist. Asian nations, on the other hand, have been very crowded, for a very long time. This has resulted in a much more interdependent mindset. Each has i…

Grain culture vs rice culture. Rice cultivation requires collective water management, so you get more collectivist cultures. Growing grain mostly depends on rain, so your harvest depends on your own work.

That's an interesting theory. Makes just as much sense as mine.

It’s really hard to be empirical, in these types of things.

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#323

Post by sghiassy »

Every mode of transportation has a sweet spot in terms of range

If you can drive somewhere in an hour - you would never take a commercial plane, etc etc

Trains peak around the 2-5 hour driving range. Which is perfect for Japan’s geographies

So the reason trains are good in Japan is that they’re best suited for the distances present in Japan

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#324

Post by jayd16 »

vantassell wrote: post #174

> Japan is one of the only countries to have privatized parking. In Europe and North America, vast quantities of parking space is socialized: municipalities own the streets and allow people to park on them at low or zero cost. Initially with the intention of encouraging the provision of more parking spaces, Japan made it illegal to park on public roads or pavements without special permission. Before someone buys a ca…

I like trains but the logic is flawed. If we banned hats, or made it so they were very expensive, less people would wear hats. And sure, probably more places would worry about shade because hats are not an option... But it doesn't really prove that's the right thing to do or that hats are inefficient use of cloth.

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#325

Post by rayiner »

bradchris wrote: post #311
tokioyoyo wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's not feasible in America because of the culture. If you have a good chunk of people that are hell-bent against sharing space with others for one reason or another (some are legitimate reasons!), you're already discarding a significant chunk of passengers. Another hot take is... if you want any of the infrastructure to be mass-used, you have to make it better than the alternatives, so people with the means…

Yes, but with caveats. Culturally, though, it’s because that over half of the population doesn’t know that they would benefit from trains? In the same way outside (just as inside) the US there’s an age-old divide between farmers and city folk (see Denmark or France for the most recent protests). In China, >66% of the population lives in urban areas. In the US, The issue is not that those areas that would benefit the…

> Culturally, though, it’s because that over half of the population doesn’t know that they would benefit from trains

No it’s not. Everyone in America goes to Disney World, which was made by a train nerd and you can’t even drive into the parks. Everyone goes there, rides around the trains and walkable areas, and then goes home to Ohio and drives around in their giant SUV.

It’s not because people don’t know about trains. It’s because they don’t value the things you do, and they value things you don’t, like having distance from strangers and being able to buy a lot of stuff and cart it around with them everywhere.

All my family is immigrants from Bangladesh. They’re not steeped in generations of American car culture. But, for some reason, car culture is the thing they assimilate into most easily. My cousin was living in Queens (where all the recent Bangladeshi immigrants are) and moved to Dallas. She’s thrilled about having all the space for her kids to run around, the apartment with a pool, etc. She doesn’t miss having to schlep her kids on the subway around aggressive homeless people, people singing to themselves, panhandlers, etc.

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#327

Post by enaaem »

rayiner wrote: post #166
Freedom2 wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sometimes see the US referred to as a "post-rail" society, meaning that it has outgrown the need for rail for the more intimate, personal transportation methods we see today. I submit that, like other HN commenters say, the US doesn't need rail due to this society. How will US citizens help their friends move or do their large (in terms of volume) Costco grocery shopping without large trucks and only using rail?

I’m probably a top 5% train nerd for the U.S. I took trains to work primarily from 2012-2020, in NYC, Philly, Baltimore, and DC. I used to ride Amtrak from Baltimore to DC every morning. I love Tokyo’s train system. I go there every year and I always take the train. But when I went there with my wife and three kids, I took a lot of Ubers! You can’t fit our double stroller with big America bags of toys and snacks on a…

If Tokyo was in America, your situation would be like this: imagine going outside of your home and walk for 10 minutes to a small hamburger shop. It only has 10 seats and it’s run a by hamburger nerd who makes elite hamburgers. This guy grinds his own beef, bakes his own buns and pickles his own pickles and everything is perfect. The burgers are only 8 dollars and you can’t even imagine of making hamburgers yourself.

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#329

Post by acdha »

kulahan wrote: post #308
newsclues wrote: post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Makes you consider the cost of anything that is “free”

"free" just means "publicly subsidized" in these cases. Not that this is a bad thing, but that's really all it is. See also: literally anything any nation pays for using tax money.

Sometimes it’s privately subsidized, too, such as when you go out to eat and your meal costs more because the restaurant provides free parking. People who don’t drive often pay higher prices subsidizing the people who do, which is something we should talk about more directly.

Re: Why Japan has such good railways

#330

Post by bobthepanda »

dullcrisp wrote: post #321
bobthepanda wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most travel happens between cities that are close together, and Chicago has always been the larger gateway to the rest of the nation and the world. The French urban areas on the TGV aren’t very big; Montpelier, for example, has a total of 600,000 people in its metro area, which is roughly the same size as Toledo, OH or Wichita, KS.

Montpellier probably gets more tourism than Toledo though. And most people taking the train to Paris are probably not doing it so they can fly somewhere else.

You actually can book an Air France/TGV combo ticket: https://wwws.airfrance.fr/en/information/prepare/voyages-com...

And yeah, there would be a fair amount of demand just to Chicago the same way there is a fair amount of demand to Paris, in that they’re both the regional powerhouses with finance, HQs, etc.

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