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We're losing our voice to LLMs

tonyalicea.dev

321–330 of 425 posts

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#321

I deleted my Facebook account a couple of years ago and my Twitter one yesterday. It's not just LLMs, it's how the algorithms promote engagement. i.e. rage bait, videos with obvious inaccuracies etc. Who gets rewarded, the content creators and the platform. Engaging with it just seems to accentuate the problem. There needs to be algorithms that promote cohorts and individuals preferences. Just because I said to someo…

I call it AI slop and human slop.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#322
post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would be astonished if a majority of people opposed to social media algorithms consider HN's approach to be sufficiently objectionable to be regulated or in any way similar to Facebook.

Hacker News doesn't use a strictly chronological feed. Hacker News manipulates the feed to promote certain items over others. Hacker News moderates legal content. Those are all features of social media algorithms that people are opposed to. It just isn't "objectionable" when HN does it. And regulations of this kind always creep out of scope. We've seen it happen countless times. But people hate social media so much a…

You're moving the goalposts.

You said:

> Most people on HN who advocate regulating social media...want to make all algorithmic feeds other than strictly chronological illegal

I don't buy that, at all. I think they want a chronological feed to follow, and they want the end of targeted outrage machines that are poisoning civil discourse and breeding the type of destructive politics that has led to our sitting U.S. president to call for critics to be hanged.

Comparing what Facebook has done to the U.S. with HN's algorithm is slippery slope fallacy to an extreme, and even if HN's front page algorithm against all odds was outlawed due to a political overreaction to the destruction Facebook has wrought, I'd call it a fair trade.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#323

If you care about voice, you still can get a lot of value from LLMs. You just have to be careful not to use a single word they generate. I've had a lot of luck using GPT5 to interrogate my own writing. A prompt I use (there are certainly better ones): "I'm an editor considering a submitted piece for a publication {describe audience here}. Is this piece worth the effort I'll need to put in, and how far will I need to…

What I struggle more with the things like Grammarly, where it's a mix of fixing very nitpicky grammar spelling structure issues that push things from casual writing with my own voice into more of a professional tone.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#324
post #289

If you care about voice, you still can get a lot of value from LLMs. You just have to be careful not to use a single word they generate. I've had a lot of luck using GPT5 to interrogate my own writing. A prompt I use (there are certainly better ones): "I'm an editor considering a submitted piece for a publication {describe audience here}. Is this piece worth the effort I'll need to put in, and how far will I need to…

All of this sounds like something you could just do yourself after putting a piece down for a day or two and coming back to it with fresh eyes. What benefit is there of cooking the oceans with a bullshit generator? Like, sure, it's possible to do this with an LLM, but it's also possible to do it without, at roughly similar levels of effort, without contributing to all of the negative externalities of the LLM/genAI ec…

Being able to get useful feedback immediately rather than 48 hours later is useful if you need text today.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#325

If you care about voice, you still can get a lot of value from LLMs. You just have to be careful not to use a single word they generate. I've had a lot of luck using GPT5 to interrogate my own writing. A prompt I use (there are certainly better ones): "I'm an editor considering a submitted piece for a publication {describe audience here}. Is this piece worth the effort I'll need to put in, and how far will I need to…

They’re also great, in my experience, for overcoming writer’s block and procrastination. Just as a rubber duck to bounce ideas off of and follow different threads.

It makes the writing process faster and more enjoyable, despite never using anything the LLM generates directly.

Workshopping with humans is even better, if you find the right humans, but they have an annoying habit of not being available 24/7.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#326
post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hacker News doesn't use a strictly chronological feed. Hacker News manipulates the feed to promote certain items over others. Hacker News moderates legal content. Those are all features of social media algorithms that people are opposed to. It just isn't "objectionable" when HN does it. And regulations of this kind always creep out of scope. We've seen it happen countless times. But people hate social media so much a…

You're moving the goalposts. You said: > Most people on HN who advocate regulating social media...want to make all algorithmic feeds other than strictly chronological illegal I don't buy that, at all. I think they want a chronological feed to follow, and they want the end of targeted outrage machines that are poisoning civil discourse and breeding the type of destructive politics that has led to our sitting U.S. pres…

>Comparing what Facebook has done to the U.S. with HN's algorithm is slippery slope fallacy to an extreme, and even if HN's front page algorithm against all odds was outlawed due to a political overreaction to the destruction Facebook has wrought, I'd call it a fair trade.

You're trying to discredit my comment but it seems as if your anger just led you around to proving me right.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#327

There's something unique about art and writing where we just don't want to see computers do it As soon as I know something is written by AI I tune out. I don't care how good it is - I'm not interested if a person didn't go through the process of writing it

I would love to see true really good AI art. Right now the issue is that AI is not there where it by itself could produce actually good art. If we had to define art it would be kind of opposite of what LLMs produce right now. LLMs try to produce the statistical norm, while art is more so about producing something out of the norm. LLMs/AI right now if it wants to try to produce out of norm things, it will only produce…

I've lost the link but there was quite a cool video of virtual architecture created by AI. It was ok because it wasn't trying to be human like - it was kind of uniquely AI. Not the exact one but this kind of stuff https://www.reddit.com/r/Futurism/comments/1oedb0m/were_ente...

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's not just LLMs, it's how the algorithms promote engagement. i.e. rage bait, videos with obvious inaccuracies etc. I guess, but I'm on quite a few "algorithm-free" forums where the same thing happens. I think it's just human nature. The reason it's under control on HN is rigorous moderation; when the moderators are asleep, you often see dubious political stuff bubble up. And in the comments, there's often a fair…

When video games first started taking advantage of behavioral reward schedules (eg: skinner box stuff such as loot crates & random drops) I noticed it, and would discuss it among friends. We had a colloquial name for the joke and we called them "crack points." (ie, like the drug) For instance, the random drops that happen in a game like Diablo 2 are rewarding in very much the same way that a slot machine is rewarding…

I think you touch on the crux of the issue here, that education ioos one of the most potent defenses against this kind of psychological manipulation.

But not just any education. The humanities side of things, which are focused on the foundations of thought, morality and human psychology.

These things are sadly lacking in technical degrees and it shows.

It's also IMO why we see the destruction of our education systems as a whole as a element of control over society.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a special, deep, loathing for linkedin. I honestly can't believe how horrible it is and I don't understand why people engage with it.

I don't understand how people can be so dismissive of LinkedIn purely for its resume function. For essentially every "knowledge worker" profession with a halfway decent CV, a well kept LinkedIn resume can easily make a difference of $X0,000 in yearly salary, and the initial setup takes one to a few hours. It's one of the best ROI actions many could do for their careers. How dismissive many engineers are of doing that…

I think this statement is highly dependent on market and geography. I, for one, have mostly received scams. For the occassional real contact, we shifted away from LinkedIn as soon as we could after the basic hello.

Re: We're losing our voice to LLMs

#330
post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"inhabited by characters ACTUALLY living in the computer" It's hard to imagine these feeling like characters from literature and not characters in the form of influencers / social media personalities. Characters in literature are in a highly constrained medium, and only have to do their story once. In a generated world the character needs to be constantly doing "story things". I think Jonathan Blow has an interesting…

Please share! Computational literature is my main area of research, and constraints are very much in the center of it... I believe that there are effectively two kinds of constraints: in the language of stories themselves, as thing-in-itself, as well as those imposed by the author. In a way, authorship is incredibly repressive: authors impose strict limits on the characters, what they get to do, etc. This is a form o…

Just so I understand who I am talking with here, when you say authorship is a form of slavery, is that because you believe the characters in a written story have a consciousness/sentience/experience just like animals do, or are you just using the word 'slavery' to mean that in traditional literature the characters are static? One of the strengths of traditional literature is that staticness, however, because the best stories from literature are necessarily highly engineered and contrived by the author. Great stories don't happen in the real world (without dramatization of the events) exactly because too many things can happen for a coherent narrative to unfold.

I'm a huge fan of Dwarf Fortress, but the stories aren't Great without imagination from the player selectively ignoring things. Kruggsmash is able to make them compelling because he is a great author

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