Live data from Hacker News

Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

bluewin.ch

321–330 of 655 posts

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#321
post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

3 years living vs dying is a 3 year net improvement on life. Such silly statement. By your logic we should kill everyone at their peak.

3 years of living in constant pain - not saying it’s the case here - is not better than being dead to some people.

[dead]

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Using exceptions to make rules is dumb.

Isn't it only exceptional because assisted suicide is relatively rare worldwide?

What has been described above is not suicide.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#323

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>He was Catholic, and wouldn't do assisted suicide. I thought Jain the perspective shared in this comment is valuable: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=45548178 Well, not just the comment, but also the wikipedia article linked to in the comment. Obviously, Jainism isn't Catholicism, but this part of the wikipedia article got me thinking: >It is not considered a suicide by Jain scholars because it is not an act of…

No, it will always be wrong to kill an innocent person whether that is yourself or another doesn't matter. Our lives are lent to us by God

"Kill" is another concept that has differing definitional scopes, depending on religion or legal system. Or even differing for the same religion/legal system for different contexts and/or time periods.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did they medicate for pain for millennia before the advent of painkillers?

Are we pretending opioids do not exist in nature? What's next, how did people hallucinate before LSD?

Before the early modern period, large portions of the world did not have any wild or cultivated opium poppies or any other strong painkillers.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#325

Not going to express an opinion, I'll just leave this except from the Hippocratic Oath [1], which reflects society's primary beliefs on this topic approximately up until the 19th century: > οὐ δώσω δὲ οὐδὲ φάρμακον οὐδενὶ αἰτηθεὶς θανάσιμον, οὐδὲ ὑφηγήσομαι συμβουλίην τοιήνδε In English: > Neither will I administer a poison to anybody when asked to do so, nor will I suggest such a course. [1]: https://en.wikipedia.or…

The modern hippocratic oath has no mention of poisons, also doesn't require the oath to be sworn before the gods of the pantheon. Up until the 19th century, physicians didn't believe in germs either. Attitudes change with the knowledge we accumulate.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#326

Daniel wrote one of my favorite books, Thinking: Fast and Slow ( https://www.amazon.com/Thinking-Fast-Slow-Daniel-Kahneman/dp... ). If you haven't read it, and you're into economics, behavioral psychology, and thinking about thinking then I'd highly recommend it. The first half of the book is especially compelling. You will be missed! Sad to hear he passed, but glad he was able to go out on his own terms.

Part of the book has been swept up in the replication crisis facing psychology and the social sciences. It was discovered many prominent research findings were difficult or impossible for others to replicate, and thus the original findings were called into question. An analysis[51] of the studies cited in chapter 4, "The Associative Machine", found that their replicability index (R-index)[52] is 14, indicating essentially low to no reliability. Kahneman himself responded to the study in blog comments and acknowledged the chapter's shortcomings: "I placed too much faith in underpowered studies."[53] Others have noted the irony in the fact that Kahneman made a mistake in judgment similar to the ones he studied.[54]

A later analysis[55] made a bolder claim that, despite Kahneman's previous contributions to the field of decision making, most of the book's ideas are based on 'scientific literature with shaky foundations'. A general lack of replication in the empirical studies cited in the book was given as a justification.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#327
post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He’d be dead either way, the question is if having those three years were a net improvement to his life

3 years living vs dying is a 3 year net improvement on life. Such silly statement. By your logic we should kill everyone at their peak.

I've known at least 2 old persons who were literally looking forward to their death because of chronic pain and general boredom and frustration of requiring 24h/7 assistance and not being able to live the way they used to.

They would have likely used assisted suicide if it had been an option back then.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#328
post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I read that in some societies, if you ended up not being able to feed yourself, they would bring you to your favorite tree and leave you there. If you ended back in camp you’d be welcomed. If you didn’t, that was your end. I found that remarkably comforting and peaceful.

If you don’t make it back you would die of starvation and lack of water. These are some of the worst ways of dying. What do you find comforting and peaceful about it? The person has been abandoned by their community and could suffer terribly for days.

The idea is the tree is not too far from camp. It should hours not days to return. And I suspect they would check on them.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#329
post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fascinating that you think someone with dementia would be suffering more from hunger then from their condition sapping away at them.

Neither you nor I know what the person with dementia is suffering from. What you call "comforting" is leaving a helpless prison in the wilderness to succumb to thirst, hunger or predators

Thirst and hunger. They’re meant to die a peaceful death so pretty sure no predators involved.

Go to a dementia facility and hang out with your those people. You will see suffering.

Re: Daniel Kahneman opted for assisted suicide in Switzerland

#330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately someone with advanced dementia does not know if she has eaten or not. Most of the time there will be no eating, unless someone else puts food in your mouth.

That wasn't the case with my father, who had a pretty good appetite up until his last few weeks.

That’s literally what it says in the story though. That it would only happen if the person won’t eat by themselves.
Post reply on HN