996 • Hacker News Board

Re: 996

#321

Post by davedx » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:30 PM UTC

ibejoeb wrote: post #153

drob518 wrote: post #95

Having worked at several startups, I’ll say that 996 is a lie. The best startups were ones that worked HARD for 8 to 10 hours, 5 days per week. What I always found at companies “working” 996 (or something close) was that mostly everyone was hanging out in the break room playing foosball or video games (or watching someone else do it). Sure, they were “in the office,” but the productivity of those hours beyond 8 was r…

If you're doing R&D and you're actually into the problem, you're probably devoting the majority of your waking hours to "working" regardless. This is a different 996 than stitching shoe welts 996. Hanging around and passively considering the problem with others can be good, productive work. If someone who actually like this kind of thing freely enters into it, well, best of luck to you. I think the shouting "996" thi…

That’s not 996 at all. 996 is an explicit number of hours mandated from above, not “shit this problem is cool I can’t stop thinking about it”

Re: 996

#322

Post by hedora » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:30 PM UTC

hamdingers wrote: post #275

hedora wrote: post #145

All the engineers that I’ve worked with that were doing 12 hour x 6 days ended up being drags on the rest of the team. Their 2am fever dream garbage would hit prod, and then it’d take a full time support person to apologize to customers while two full time engineers wasted a week refactoring production into something that worked. Anyway, I’ve noticed I can only work 6 hours if I write code myself, but can easily hit…

I tried 10-4 for 6 months at a company that had a mix of people working 4 and 5 days, it made me less productive and more burnt out as a senior engineer. I have ~5 hours of productive creative energy per sleep, others may be different but that's me. Ideally I give 4 hours to the job, spend 4 hours reviewing/meeting/etc. and have 1 for myself. If I push myself beyond that, I start doing substandard work, so 10-4 meant…

I’ve been the same way for most of my career. If I’m using a coding assistant, I end up doing 2-3 hours of hard thinking and 7-8 of babysitting. Unlike meetings, I don’t have to use any emotional/social energy with the coding assistant.

Re: 996

#323

Post by Aeroi » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:31 PM UTC

commenting because this was 996 at 669 points

Re: 996

#324

Post by jeremyjh » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:31 PM UTC

petermcneeley wrote: post #207

jeremyjh wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you are saying you’ve worked in your garden for 12 hours a day? Multiple days in a row?

Jokes aside yes people work very hard on things, even for years, if they believe in them. From dawn to dusk; of their own free will. Work being bad is simply a slave mentality. It is because the slave does not get any return on their effort; only sustenance.

So you haven't then?

Re: 996

#325

Post by SilverElfin » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:31 PM UTC

dclowd9901 wrote: post #297

whstl wrote: post #177

996 is just theater for investors. Saw this happening even at YC companies. There was always that stupid expectation of overworking, staying until 9. The reality is that people twiddle thumbs. And the disorganization and micromanagement power plays are enough to negate any additional worked hour. This ranges from pure disorganization in terms of what to build to having 3 hour meetings with the whole fucking company w…

Yeah they point to Chinese work culture but I think it probably resembles more Japanese work culture where you're just filling a seat until your boss leaves.

From what I’ve heard, the 996 culture in China isn’t just for appearances. It’s a real grueling grind and employees have not much choice to find a different job. But obviously it’s bad for health and happiness and unfair.

Re: 996

#326

Post by davedx » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:32 PM UTC

santiagobasulto wrote: post #303

You're all answering from a very privileged standpoint. I started my career in tech from a small town in Argentina. When broadband was prevalent around the world (2012) I was still working with a dial up connection on a $200 computer. I grew up seeing what poverty and lack of opportunities does to people, and I was determined to break away from that. I got a job at a startup by sheer luck, and it completely changed m…

I don’t know if I would classify “living in a country with labour laws” as “very privileged”

Re: 996

#327

Post by PaulHoule » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:32 PM UTC

MonkeyClub wrote: post #224

PaulHoule wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Touch fish?

Check out mentally and "go fishing"

Fishing with bare hands is possible but notoriously challenging.

Re: 996

#328

Post by dyauspitr » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:33 PM UTC

cushychicken wrote: post #158

dyauspitr wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The more upfront they are, the more normalized it gets which encourages other companies to do the same.

That’s a slippery slope argument. Plenty of employers do not operate with this expectation. In the US, I’d replace “plenty” with “most”. Plenty of employers recognize an opportunity to differentiate themselves to candidates by publicly not being 996’ers.

You give an inch and capital will take a mile, especially in this environment where they have completely eliminated any opposition from unions and we have an economy that is failing to create jobs.

Re: 996

#329

Post by SilverElfin » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:33 PM UTC

gambiting wrote: post #170

Aurornis wrote: post #23

When founders put 996 in their job descriptions or Tweet about their 996 culture it’s a helpful signal to avoid that company. The only time I’d actually consider crazy schedules was if I was the founder with a huge equity stake and a once in a lifetime opportunity that would benefit from a short period of 996. For average employees? Absolutely not. If someone wants extraordinary hours they need to be providing extrao…

I think even if someone offered me couple million a year I still wouldn't do it. My kids will only be kids once - all of the money in the world is completely worthless if you miss out on your family. I appreciate some people here don't feel this way but to me that's not a trade off I would ever make. Especially since as software engineers we are privileged enough to usually command both high salaries and the ability…

It’s impossible for anyone not in their 20s or who has kids or just a healthy balanced life.

Re: 996

#330

Post by margalabargala » Sat, Sep 06, 2025, 5:34 PM UTC

robterrell wrote: post #106

Aurornis wrote: post #23

When founders put 996 in their job descriptions or Tweet about their 996 culture it’s a helpful signal to avoid that company. The only time I’d actually consider crazy schedules was if I was the founder with a huge equity stake and a once in a lifetime opportunity that would benefit from a short period of 996. For average employees? Absolutely not. If someone wants extraordinary hours they need to be providing extrao…

If you're smart enough to get hired for one of these roles, and you're willing to work 996, be just a little bit smarter and found your own startup and take all the upside.

> If you're smart enough to get hired for one of these roles

I think your framing is backwards.

Getting hired as a random employee, going in expecting 9-9-6, with the sort of comp these companies manage to pay, means there is a smartness ceiling, not floor.