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Jujutsu for busy devs

maddie.wtf

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Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#321

Post by dpc_01234 »

stouset wrote: post #33

For anyone who's debating whether or not jj is worth learning, I just want to highlight something. Whenever it comes up on Hacker News, there are generally two camps of people: those who haven't given it a shot yet and those who evangelize it. You will be hard-pressed to find someone who stuck with it for a week and decided to go back to git. You will not find a lot of people who say they switched but just stayed out…

Fwiw. It took me 4 or 5 attempts of various lengths (2 to 10 days) before I actually sticked with it. I've hit unimplemented deal breakers and was generally uncomfortable a lot. Now I like it more than git, but I don't think the difference is large and stacking commits is a bit of a pass time for me. I do it more now because it's easier but I would just do less of it with git and no one would care much.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#322

Post by endtime »

palata wrote: post #166
stouset wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For a lot of people, making small and tightly-focused branches that are easy to review and merge is very important. This is where jj excels. Especially if you find yourself often doing large chunks of work between convenient checkpoints, but you still want to create commits as if this work was all done in tiny and discrete chunks. It's also very helpful if you're the kind of developer who makes lots of unrelated chan…

I tend to `git add -p` and create different commits that I put on different branches if they are unrelated. Doesn't feel painful in git, but I'd like to see an example doing that with jj. Maybe I'll try.

jj lets you do this with changes that are related.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#323

Post by DrBazza »

palata wrote: post #143
stouset wrote: post #33

For anyone who's debating whether or not jj is worth learning, I just want to highlight something. Whenever it comes up on Hacker News, there are generally two camps of people: those who haven't given it a shot yet and those who evangelize it. You will be hard-pressed to find someone who stuck with it for a week and decided to go back to git. You will not find a lot of people who say they switched but just stayed out…

> For anyone who's debating whether or not jj is worth learning I don't have any productivity issues with git, like... at all. It's not like I spend an hour running git commands every day. I can totally imagine that some people spend their day manipulating repos with git, and jj is better for them. But that's not my case, and git is already everywhere. To me it sounds like telling me: "You HAVE TO move to bim , the b…

>I don't have any productivity issues with git, like... at all. It's not like I spend an hour running git commands every day.

Agreed. Having used SCCS, CVS, Subversion, VSS, Perforce, Clearcase, Accurev (the weirdest of the lot), Mercurial and Git, I'll move when the market decides what has critical mass and my job needs it.

jj feels a bit like learning a Dvorak keyboard and then being in an office of qwerty. Jobs want git, my colleagues know git, I'll be asked a question about... git. Using git has been the lowest version control churn in my brain for a decade, which is nice.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#324

Post by sshine »

__turbobrew__ wrote: post #317
stouset wrote: post #33

For anyone who's debating whether or not jj is worth learning, I just want to highlight something. Whenever it comes up on Hacker News, there are generally two camps of people: those who haven't given it a shot yet and those who evangelize it. You will be hard-pressed to find someone who stuck with it for a week and decided to go back to git. You will not find a lot of people who say they switched but just stayed out…

How fast I can deliver value is almost never gated by my VCS, so why should I try? In total I maybe lose a few minutes a month to VCS impedance mismatch, and I am merging on average ~4-5 PRs a day. For sure git is hard to learn for beginners and there could be an alternative which is easier to pick up (maybe jj) but for those who know how git works internally and are proficient with it I don’t see it being worth the…

> How fast I can deliver value is almost never gated by my VCS

Oh, the number of times I do

  git commit --fixup ...searches `git log` and pastes`... && \
    git rebase -i --autosquash ...that same commit^...
I waste several half minutes several times per day in periods!

Another time-consuming thing is context-switching from a feature branch with staged/unstaged changes. If you're good with worktrees, you can largely avoid this, but the way I work with worktrees, I instantiate them as subdirectories to my repo's parent, which clutters my directories unless I make space for this as I clone the repository, which I haven't got used to.

I deliberately avoid too complicated git workflow aliases because I hate being stuck without them.

I am definitely in the camp of "I'd switch to jj the moment I give myself time to try it."

In the meantime, running git commands does sometimes take more time than it needs to.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#325

Post by nchmy »

riwsky wrote: post #318
nchmy wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The relevant question is, why would a stranger take time out of their life to evangelize an open source VCS tool? What other tools do people do that for? Not many. I see the most similar language and behaviour with regards to uv, which similarly revolutionized/simplified python tooling. Likewise mise, which makes it similarly frictionless to install and manage tooling and their versions across projects and system-wid…

“Trauma” is a bit much.

Definitely applies more to uv than jj, but jj is still immensely liberating. To the extent that people are willing to evangelize it to no gain of their own.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#326

Post by nchmy »

pjmlp wrote: post #314
nchmy wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you choose your own IDE? if so, you should be able to choose how you manage git locally, such as with jj.

Nope, you get the IT validated image as per project delivery assignment, in many cases not even local, for security reasons it is a cloud VM.

Ok, so I'm just having trouble seeing how your situation is at all relevant to this discussion about the merits of jj. You simply have to use what you're assigned.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#327

Post by christophilus »

weinzierl wrote: post #124
stouset wrote: post #33

For anyone who's debating whether or not jj is worth learning, I just want to highlight something. Whenever it comes up on Hacker News, there are generally two camps of people: those who haven't given it a shot yet and those who evangelize it. You will be hard-pressed to find someone who stuck with it for a week and decided to go back to git. You will not find a lot of people who say they switched but just stayed out…

"You will be hard-pressed to find someone who stuck with it for a week and decided to go back to git. " Reporting in. Doesn't mean I will not end up with jj eventually, but so far I always went back to git after a while. For me it is the staging area and the workflow it allows. Most people hate it and love jj because it does away with it. That is just not me. I don't see the staging area as a hack that was necessary…

I’m similar.

On the other hand, tools like jj seem great for people who spend a lot of time refining and perfecting every commit so that their repo history is pristine. I’m not one of those people. My git hygiene is atrocious. I have git halitosis. But functionally, it’s fine. Everything is in the git history and is recoverable. That’s about all I care about.

Also, I don’t have the capacity to juggle a lot in my mind. If someone does, then sure, jj may facilitate that. But I don’t need such facilitation.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#328

Post by pton_xd »

accelbred wrote: post #39

Is there a magit equivalent? I heavily use magit's interactive features and extensions to the git UI (like spinoff, absorb, or the auto-backup thing)

Wondering the same. I've been using magit for a long time now and never use the git cli anymore. Going back to manually typing in commands doesn't sound appealing. The unified index/workspace non-stash-workflow does sound somewhat nice, though.

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#329

Post by kavenkanum »

If only it was supported by Gui tools... I don't bother use Git from my terminal, but use GiFork instead. As I understand there is nothing that may be interesting for me in my scenario...

Re: Jujutsu for busy devs

#330

Post by pjmlp »

nchmy wrote: post #326
pjmlp wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, you get the IT validated image as per project delivery assignment, in many cases not even local, for security reasons it is a cloud VM.

Ok, so I'm just having trouble seeing how your situation is at all relevant to this discussion about the merits of jj. You simply have to use what you're assigned.

It isn't, you decided it was, reposting my comment.

> If I had an option, I would still be using something like Subversion or Mercurial.

> As it is, I go with whatever our clients require of us, and that isn't jj.

I share no desire to use jj in those words.

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