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GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

glp1digest.com

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Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#321

Post by make3 »

nwienert wrote: post #308
make3 wrote: post #237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like your example shows the inverse of what you want. SSRI are actually great at helping the person develop healthy mechanisms (compared to GLP-1s), because they reduce the mood swings & negative thoughts, allowing the person to be more productive & be more involved in their therapy, in reading, journaling, doing sports, etc. It's just that it might take two or three years and not months, which is fine because…

How are people so consistently wrong about GLP-1s? The side effects are minuscule in comparison to SSRI’s and the effects on improving habits are massive.

SSRIs barely have side effects

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#322

Post by craz8 »

gregw134 wrote: post #245
loeg wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They aren't even that awful in maintenance -- just expensive. The unpleasant part is when you're increasing the dose. After a while at the same dose, it's more or less unnoticeable IMO.

Unnoticable meaning doesn't have any effect at all, or just no bad side effects?

I have 2 measurable ones on Zepbound.

My lowest sleeping heart rate is now at least 10 beats higher than before starting (it comes down during the week to about 10 over)

The night after taking the injection my sleep is crap, and the heart rate is 5+ higher again

I have lost 20lbs since mid March with no real effort, and we’re about to do some blood tests for specific cholesterol numbers, which was one of the reasons to try this out.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#323

Post by altcognito »

helicalmix wrote: post #99
aqme28 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re thinking too highly about the incentives of the US healthcare system. Since insurance is tied to your employer (and therefore changing every few years), and most people die on Medicare, there’s not much incentive for insurance companies to pay for preventative care that won’t actually help you for several decades.

hmm...doesn't this possibly incentivize ozempic subsidies even more? If you know a "customer" of yours (an individual employee) is only going to be with you until they either change jobs or go on Medicare, then it seems the name of the game then is to make sure that nothing catastrophic happens to them until you can hand them off to someone else. In which case, they should definitely go on ozempic. Even if the effect…

If you were guaranteed 5% over the total cost of the medical services provided as profit, would you want people to have expensive or cheap medical. Are?

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#324

Post by tsimionescu »

aetherson wrote: post #150
dragonwriter wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a maintenance medicine, not a cure, so if people stop taking it, they return to the same problems they had without it.

And it's under-commented upon because it's counterintuitive, but most people stop taking it. Like, two year continuation of use is about 25%. That's kinda wild, because it seems like holy shit if you're taking a drug that lets you drop 10-20% of your body weight from obese down to normal why would you stop taking it, but people do.

You can also think about it the other way - if a drug caused you to lose 10-20% of your body weight, and you're now at a good body weight after 2 years, why would you want to lose another 10-20% body weight?

I understand that's not really how it works, but people often go very much by feel more than anything else.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#325

Post by int_19h »

jtrn wrote: post #226
k__ wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much does it cost right now? Are there any alternatives coming out soon or generics?

For semaglutide, the newest and most potent GLP1. United States: The main patent is expected to expire around 2032. Monthly Price: $950 - $1,350+ (cash price without insurance) Norway: The main patent is expected to expire around 2031. Monthly Price: $109 - $301 (cash price equivalent in USD)

If these things really boost life expectancy that much, this sounds like a textbook case for eminent domain.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#326

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

cm2187 wrote: post #199
romaaeterna wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, the dose required to maintain a stable weight seems to be lower than the dose required to lose weight. Most people tend to regain some weight when going cold turkey. The safety profile of the drugs with diabetics, and the health benefits that come from the associated weight loss may make permanent use a net benefit for most people. There appears to be little, if any, "course correction" effect from takin…

It depends how you define "short period of time". When I started, I lost 40kg in a matter of 5 months. Is that short? If you develop a tolerance to the product, then it doesn't protect you long term from gaining back weight, combined with you losing the option to do a rapid descent. I am not saying that those variations are great from a health point of view, but they are certainly not as bad as staying obese.

Yeah that's quite short. Healthy weight loss is typically in the ~.5-1 kg/week, while this is an extended period at 2-4x that rate. The effect that will have will largely depend on what your starting weight is, but unless you're starting significantly north of 140kg, it seems like the amount of muscle (and maybe bone density?) loss would be pretty severe.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#327

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

etothepii wrote: post #46
PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Put a little differently, they can predict that of your cohort (defined somehow), after June 2027, only X percent of you will still be alive. Will you be one of them? Click here to find out!

For mortality tables age and sex are pretty much sufficient to get to 98% accuracy.

You definitely (at least in the US) need income (or an income proxy like zip code). Mississippi has a life expectancy ~10 years less than Massachusettes.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#328

Post by adgjlsfhk1 »

octo888 wrote: post #118
brokensegue wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

billion issues? i saw some reporting on rare cases of blindness. what else?

Pancreas issues and hair loss IIRC?

Hair loss is

1. Exactly the type of "side effect" that people will report because they lost hair (because lots of people experience hair loss whether they are on a GLP1 or not)

2. A fairly minor side effect that wouldn't be a strong reason to not prescribe.

Pancreas issues were worried about, but those worries (so far) appear to be unfounded. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC6382780/ is a meta-analysis of 12 studies (36k patients) over 2 years that showed no evidence of increased pacreatic issues, and https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38175642/ is a 7 year analysis of ~33k patients that also shows no increase in issues.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#329

Post by Aurornis »

petesergeant wrote: post #319
Aurornis wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone likes to bash the US healthcare system, but at the same time it’s remarkable how much subsidized GLP-1 access Americans are getting compared to much of the world. The paradox of discussing healthcare online.

> it’s remarkable how much subsidized GLP-1 access Americans are getting Mounjaro is between 25-50% of the US price in other countries

I was referring to insurance coverage. Most people aren’t paying that inflated price.

Whenever you see a very large number for a medication or service in the United States, the patient doesn’t actually pay that number.

Companies generally have separate coverage programs for people paying out of pocket that drastically reduces the patient pay amount.

Those giant numbers attached to medications are virtually never paid by the patient.

Re: GLP-1s are breaking life insurance

#330

Post by blackqueeriroh »

hiAndrewQuinn wrote: post #23

So... There's a miracle drug powerful enough to robustly lower people's all cause mortality, but since health insurance and life insurance are industries with vastly different time preferences, this is not a good thing for the life insurers because people just keep getting off the magic longevity drug and screwing up their predictions. Because, admittedly, it kind of sucks in the moment to be on. And I'm guessing jus…

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