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Nvidia won, we all lost

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Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#321

Post by senko »

rewgs wrote: post #297
senko wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AMD GPUs aren't good enough. Software. AMD has traditionally been really bad at their drivers. (They also missed the AI train and are trying to catch up). I use Linux and have learned not to touch AMD GPUs (and to a lesser extent CPUs due to chipset quality/support) a long time ago. Even if they are better now, (I feel) Intel integrated (if no special GPU perf needed) or NVidia are less risky choices.

> I use Linux and have learned not to touch AMD GPUs (and to a lesser extent CPUs due to chipset quality/support) a long time ago. Even if they are better now, (I feel) Intel integrated (if no special GPU perf needed) or NVidia are less risky choices. Err, what? While you're right about Intel integrated GPUs being a safe choice, AMD has long since been the GPU of choice for Linux -- it just works. Whereas Nvidia on L…

Had major problems with xinerama, suspend/resume, vsync, probably a bunch of other stuff.

That said, I've been avoiding AMD in general for so long the ecosystem might have really improved in the meantime, as there was no incentive for me to try and switch.

Recently I've been dabbling in AI where AMD GPUs (well, sw ecosystem, really) are lagging behind. Just wasn't worth the hassle.

NVidia hw, once I set it up (which may be a bit involved), has been pretty stable for me.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#322

Post by Rapzid »

grg0 wrote: post #153
oilkillsbirds wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And no I don’t work for nvidia. I’ve just been in the industry long enough to watch the immense contribution nvidia has made to every. single. field. The work of their researchers is astounding, it’s clear to anyone that’s honestly worked in this field long enough. It’s insane to hate on them.

Their contribution to various fields and the fact that they treat the average consumer like shit nowadays are not mutually exclusive. Also, nobody ever said they hate their researchers.

Maybe the average consumer doesn't agree they are being treated like shit? Steam top 10 GPU list is almost all NVidia. Happy customers or duped suckers? I've seen the later sentiment a lot over the years and discounting consumer's preferences never seems to lead to correct prediction of outcomes..

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#323

Post by StochasticLi »

jezze wrote: post #320
datagram wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AMD cards are fine from a raw performance perspective, but Nvidia has built themselves a moat of software/hardware features like ray-tracing, video encoding, CUDA, DLSS, etc where AMD's equivalents have simply not been as good. With their current generation of cards AMD has caught up on all of those things except CUDA, and Intel is in a similar spot now that they've had time to improve their drivers, so it's pretty e…

I have no experience of using it so I might be wrong but AMD has ROCm which has something called HIP that should be comparable to CUDA. I think it also has a way to automatically translate CUDA calls into HIP as well so it should work without the need to modify your code.

it's mostly about AI training at this point. the software for this only supports CUDA well.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#324

Post by ho_schi »

senko wrote: post #296
darkoob12 wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a gamer and don't why AMD GPUs aren't good enough. It's weird since both Xbox and PlayStation are using AMD GPUs. I guess there games that you can only play on PC with Nvidia graphics. That begs the question why someone create a game and ignore large console market.

> AMD GPUs aren't good enough. Software. AMD has traditionally been really bad at their drivers. (They also missed the AI train and are trying to catch up). I use Linux and have learned not to touch AMD GPUs (and to a lesser extent CPUs due to chipset quality/support) a long time ago. Even if they are better now, (I feel) Intel integrated (if no special GPU perf needed) or NVidia are less risky choices.

This is wrong. For 14 years the recommendation on Linux is:

    * Purchase always AMD.      
    * Purchase never Nvidia.
    * Intel is also okay.
Because the AMD drivers are good and open-source. And AMD cares about bug reports. The one from Nvidia can and will create issues because they’re closed-source and avoided for years to support Wayland. Now Nvidia published source-code and refuses to merge it into Linux and Mesa facepalm

While Nvidia comes up with proprietary stuff AMD brought us Vulkan, FreeSync, supported Wayland well already with Implicit-Sync (like Intel) and used the regular Video-Acceleration APIs for long time.

Meanwhile Nvidia:

https://registry.khronos.org/OpenGL/extensions/NV/NV_robustn...

    It’s not a bug, it’s a feature!
Their bad drivers still don’t handle simple actions like a VT-Switch or Suspend/Resume. If a developer doesn’t know about that extension the users suffer for years.

Okay. But that is probably only a short term solution? It is Nvidias short term solution since 2016!

https://www.phoronix.com/news/NVIDIA-Ubuntu-2025-SnR

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#325

Post by simion314 »

rewgs wrote: post #297
senko wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> AMD GPUs aren't good enough. Software. AMD has traditionally been really bad at their drivers. (They also missed the AI train and are trying to catch up). I use Linux and have learned not to touch AMD GPUs (and to a lesser extent CPUs due to chipset quality/support) a long time ago. Even if they are better now, (I feel) Intel integrated (if no special GPU perf needed) or NVidia are less risky choices.

> I use Linux and have learned not to touch AMD GPUs (and to a lesser extent CPUs due to chipset quality/support) a long time ago. Even if they are better now, (I feel) Intel integrated (if no special GPU perf needed) or NVidia are less risky choices. Err, what? While you're right about Intel integrated GPUs being a safe choice, AMD has long since been the GPU of choice for Linux -- it just works. Whereas Nvidia on L…

>Err, what? While you're right about Intel integrated GPUs being a safe choice, AMD has long since been the GPU of choice for Linux -- it just works. Whereas Nvidia on Linux has been flaky for as long as I can remember.

Not OP, I had same experience in the past with AMD,I bought a new laptop and in 6 months the AMD decided that my card is obsolete and no longer provided drivers forcing me to be stuck with older kernel/X11 , so I switched to NVIDIA and after 2 PC changes I still use NVIDIA since the official drivers work great, I really hope AMD this time is putting the effort to keep older generations of cards working on latest kernels/X11 maybe next card will be AMD.

But this is an explanations why us some older Linux users have bad memories with AMD and we had good reason to switch over to NVIDIA and no good reason to switch back to AMD

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#326

Post by PoshBreeze »

esseph wrote: post #292
PoshBreeze wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on the games you play and what you are doing. It is a mixed bag IME. If you are installing a game that is several years old it will work wonderfully. Most guides assume you have Arch Linux or are using one of the "gaming" distros like Bazzite. I use Debian (I am running Testing/Trixie RC on my main PC). I play a lot of HellDivers 2. Despite what a lot of Linux YouTubers say. It doesn't work very well on Li…

Fedora 42, Helldivers 2 Make sure to change your Steam launch options to: PULSE_LATENCY_MSEC=84 gamemoderun %command% This will use gamemode to run it, give it priority, put the system in performance power mode, and will fix any pulse audio static you may be having. You can do this for any game you launch with steam, any shortcut, etc. It's missing probably 15fps on this card between windows and Linux, and since it's…

I will be honest, I just gave up. I couldn't get consistent performance on HellDivers 2. Many of the things you have mentioned I've tried and found they don't make much of a difference or made things worse.

I did get it running nice for about a day and then an update was pushed and it ran like rubbish again. The game runs smoothly when initially running the map and then massive dip in frames for several seconds. This is usually when one of the bugs is jumping at you.

This game may work better on Fedora/Bazzite or but I find Debian to be super reliable and don't want to switch distro. I also don't like Fedora generally as I've found it unreliable in the past. I had a look at Bazzite and I honestly just wasn't interested. This is due to it having a bunch of technologies that I have no interest in using.

There are other issues that are tangential but related issues.

e.g.

I normally play on Super HellDive with other players in a Discord VC. Discord / Pipewire seems to reset my sound for no particular reason and my Plantronics Headset Mic (good headset, not some gamer nonsense) will be not found. This requires a restart of pipewire/wireplumber and Discord (in that order). This happens often enough I have a shell script alias called "fix_discord".

I have weird audio problems on HDMI (AMD card) thanks to a regression in the kernel (Kernel 6.1 with Debian worked fine).

I could mess about with this for ages and maybe get it working or just reboot into Windows which takes me all of a minute.

It is just easier to use Windows for Gaming. Then use Linux for work stuff.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#327

Post by pointlessone »

neuroelectron wrote: post #42

Seems a bit calculated and agreed across the industry. What can really make sense of Microsoft's acquisitions and ruining of billion dollar IPs? It's a manufactured collapse of the gaming industry. They want to centralize control of the market and make it a service based (rent seeking) sector. I'm not saying they all got together and decided this together but their wonks are probably all saying the same thing. The ma…

If it’s manufactured it implies intent. Someone at Microsoft is doing it on purpose and, presumably, thinks it’ll benefit them. I’m not sure how this can be seen as a win for them. They invested a massive amount of money into buying all those game studios. They also admitted Xbox hardware is basically dead. So the only way they can any return on that investment is third party hardware: either PlayStation or PC. If I were to choose it would be pc for MS. They already have game pass and windows is the gaming OS. By giving business to Sony they would undermine those.

I don’t think nVidia wants gaming collapse either. They might not prioritize it now but they definitely know that it will persist in some form. They bet on AI (and crypto before it) because those are lucrative opportunities but there’s no guarantee they will last. So they squeeze as much as they can out of those while they can. They definitely want gaming as a backup. It might be not as profitable and more finicky as it’s a consumer market but it’s much more stable in the long run.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#328

Post by hank808 »

voxleone wrote: post #148

It’s reasonable to argue that NVIDIA has a de facto monopoly in the field of GPU-accelerated compute, especially due to CUDA (Compute Unified Device Architecture). While not a legal monopoly in the strict antitrust sense (yet), in practice, NVIDIA's control over the GPU compute ecosystem — particularly in AI, HPC, and increasingly in professional content creation — is extraordinarily dominant.

Thanks ChatGPT!

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#329

Post by immibis »

stodor89 wrote: post #281
__turbobrew__ wrote: post #49

> With over 90% of the PC market running on NVIDIA tech, they’re the clear winner of the GPU race. The losers are every single one of us. I have been rocking AMD GPU ever since the drivers were upstreamed into the linux kernel. No regrets. I have also realized that there is a lot out there in the world besides video games, and getting all in a huff about it isn’t worth my time or energy. But consumer gotta consoooooo…

> I have also realized that there is a lot out there in the world besides video games, and getting all in a huff about it isn’t worth my time or energy. I think more and more people will realize games are a waste of time for them and go on to find other hobbies. As a game developer, it kinda worries me. As a gamer, I can't wait for gaming to be a niche thing again, haha.

Fortunately for your business model, there's a constant stream of new people to replace the ones who are aging out. But you have to make sure your product is appealing to them, not just to the same people who bought it last decade.

Re: Nvidia won, we all lost

#330

Post by [deleted] »

bigyabai wrote: post #6

> Pretty much all upscalers force TAA for anti-aliasing and it makes the entire image on the screen look blurry as fuck the lower the resolution is. I feel like this is a misunderstanding, though I admit I'm splitting hairs here. DLSS is a form of TAA, and so is FSR and most other modern upscalers. You generally don't need an extra antialiasing pipeline if you're getting an artificially supersampled image. We've seen…

[deleted]
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