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Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

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Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#321

Post by _heimdall »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #42

It's wild that a president can say, "I don't like Elon anymore, so out of retaliation, I'm canceling all his government contracts," and ~40% of the country doesn't see that as corruption in any way, shape, or form. Government contracts should not be based on whether or not the president likes the CEO, and the CEO says enough good things about the president. If you can cancel contacts not based on merit, then it shoul…

> If you can cancel contacts not based on merit

That's a hard argument to hold in the context of recent history. Maybe for the better, maybe for worse, merit has taken a back seat in many cases as we prioritized other factors.

What's interesting to me here is that the executive branch has authority to change these contracts. I do understand that's how it has worked for a while, and you could argue that these contracts are part of executing on congress's mandate, but I personally would prefer the executive branch not have this power.

If it were up to me congressional committees would be responsible for this as part of budgeting responsibilities, and the executive branch would be much weaker than it is today.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#322

Post by busyant »

state_less wrote: post #23

What does SpaceX have to do with the Musk/Trump spat? Shouldn't those SpaceX contracts be based on how well the country is served by them and at what price. Trump needs to take his lumps on his BBB. That bill is full of pork for billionaires and cuts funding for poor folks. It should come as no surprise that people don't like it.

> Shouldn't those SpaceX contracts be based on how well the country is served by them and at what price.

I'm always amazed when I read questions like this.

I mean ... have you been paying attention?

Law firms getting security clearances canceled, incarceration without due process, Harvard defunded, memecoins, gutting of the federal government, &c. &c. &c. &c.

Every data point screams malevolence and lack of concern for the common good of the nation.

And you're confused about decision-making over SpaceX that "seems" to ignore how the country is best served?

Don't get me wrong. You pose a valid question. In fact, only a person who himself cares about the common good would ask this type of question.

But man, the big flashing warning signs should be answering your question for you.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#323

Post by wrs »

_heimdall wrote: post #321
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #42

It's wild that a president can say, "I don't like Elon anymore, so out of retaliation, I'm canceling all his government contracts," and ~40% of the country doesn't see that as corruption in any way, shape, or form. Government contracts should not be based on whether or not the president likes the CEO, and the CEO says enough good things about the president. If you can cancel contacts not based on merit, then it shoul…

> If you can cancel contacts not based on merit That's a hard argument to hold in the context of recent history. Maybe for the better, maybe for worse, merit has taken a back seat in many cases as we prioritized other factors. What's interesting to me here is that the executive branch has authority to change these contracts. I do understand that's how it has worked for a while, and you could argue that these contract…

As with so many other things the executive branch is doing right now, it doesn’t have exclusive power to do this. Congress sets the rules for how procurement works.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#324

Post by brookst »

lostlogin wrote: post #258
lern_too_spel wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your causal diagram is backwards. Identity politics isn't the path to corruption. Corrupt politicians like Trump use identity politics to gain power to practice their corruption. Nobody who wanted to bring back Christian hegemony and re-oppress minority groups is cheering that Trump is threatening to take away contracts from Musk because "their side is winning."

> minority groups This includes ‘women’. A group that probably has a small majority.

Women are definitely a majority by demographics.

But in the US, “minority” means “less poticial power”. By any reasonable measure straight white “Christian” men should be about 20% of the population, yet somehow they have 80% of political power.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#325

Post by _heimdall »

KennyBlanken wrote: post #243
clumsysmurf wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> corruption is actually considered a benefit! This is because the loyalists interpret this as "we" are winning and "they" are losing. I think the end goal is domination. From https://mastodon.social/@JuliusGoat/109551955251655267 : It’s best to understand that fascists see hypocrisy as a virtue. It’s how they signal that the things they are doing to people were never meant to be equally applied. It’s not an inconsis…

[flagged]

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Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#326

Post by dinkumthinkum »

JCattheATM wrote: post #204
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #42

It's wild that a president can say, "I don't like Elon anymore, so out of retaliation, I'm canceling all his government contracts," and ~40% of the country doesn't see that as corruption in any way, shape, or form. Government contracts should not be based on whether or not the president likes the CEO, and the CEO says enough good things about the president. If you can cancel contacts not based on merit, then it shoul…

~40% of the country sees that as strength. Democracies only really work with an educated and altruistic population, and the US is only getting further away from that.

[flagged]

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#327

Post by 1vuio0pswjnm7 »

onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #42

It's wild that a president can say, "I don't like Elon anymore, so out of retaliation, I'm canceling all his government contracts," and ~40% of the country doesn't see that as corruption in any way, shape, or form. Government contracts should not be based on whether or not the president likes the CEO, and the CEO says enough good things about the president. If you can cancel contacts not based on merit, then it shoul…

https://www.warren.senate.gov/newsroom/press-releases/new-wa...

https://www.warren.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/130_days_of_elon...

https://cepr.net/publications/corrupt-control-of-the-trump-a...

If Musk is engaging in corruption with respect to the US government, then what could be done to stop it. Whatever the answer, almost certainly Musk's ties to the government would need to be broken, including contracts and funding.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#328

Post by overfeed »

nradov wrote: post #273
catlifeonmars wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The point is we won’t find out because presidential immunity also protects against discovery. Cases that previously could have been decided on the merits won’t even make it to adjudication.

No, that's not how it works. The Trump v. United States case had no bearing on civil discovery.

Bur it protects against criminal discovery, Civil cases can be quashed by current president uaing methods that used to be criminal for a president.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#329

Post by brookst »

sandworm101 wrote: post #318
onlyrealcuzzo wrote: post #42

It's wild that a president can say, "I don't like Elon anymore, so out of retaliation, I'm canceling all his government contracts," and ~40% of the country doesn't see that as corruption in any way, shape, or form. Government contracts should not be based on whether or not the president likes the CEO, and the CEO says enough good things about the president. If you can cancel contacts not based on merit, then it shoul…

The new reality. Every corporate decision made today now must involve an analysis of the local and national government authority, thier political leanings and thier tendancy towards vindictivness. Does anyone not think that every major corporation is not commissioning psychological reports on certain US leaders? They have public affairs and social media consultants to gauge public reactions. Now they need head shrink…

Why pay shrinks when you can pay baksheesh to political underlings who claim to be connected? Sure, most of them aren’t, but corruption is a statistics game. You spend $100k on that one guy who really does sleep with the masseuse of the astrologist for dear leader, and it can be a 10,000% return in days.

Re: Musk-Trump dispute includes threats to SpaceX contracts

#330

Post by brookst »

WalterBright wrote: post #244
sigmoid10 wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

American democracy died on the day the supreme court overturned campaign finance restrictions. Since then US politics is a mere playground for billionaires and corporations.

Harris outspent Trump 3:1. Hillary outspent Trump 2:1. It's not that easy to buy an election.

Elon spent more on behalf of Trump than the entire official Harris campaign spent. This is a terrible argument.

We know the Supreme Court legalized unlimited campaign spending, and we’re not dumb enough to think Elon’s money wasn’t part of the Trump campaign.

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