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"Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

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Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#321

Post by diputsmonro »

mrguyorama wrote: post #280
buttercraft wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> legislative gridlock and dysfunction Isn't this a direct result of "no compromise" policies on one side of the aisle?

Right, democrats were ALWAYS looking for compromise. Hell, democrats have to compromise with their own party! If you doubt me, simply go read votes from the past 20 years, and compare it with say 1960-1980. Republicans do not cross the aisle anymore. The interesting part is that at some point republicans had so propagandized their voters against the very concept of governance that "Elect me to office for the next 6 y…

For those looking for something to Google or concrete facts to back this up, "obstructionism" is the proper term for this.

Some key examples: Reagan saying "the government is the problem", Newt Gingrich starting the modern obstructionist movement in congress with the Contact with America (also backed by the Heritage Foundation, which is behind project 2025), and Mitch McConnel breaking norms to practically shut down congress under his leadership, openly stating his intent several times.

Republicans don't want to lead in any practical sense. They want to break the government and privatize the pieces so they can buy in and profit off of them. Anyone who can't buy in gets screwed, because services will cost more to pay for the investment and profits that the investors demand.

Trump's biggest achievement last term was a massive tax cut for the rich. So to balance to budget, they now want to destroy as many government services as they can, using "efficiency" as an excuse.

Breaking things is great when you run a social media company. Worst case scenario, your website goes offline for a few hours. When you start breaking the government, people die. Of course, if you're richer than God, you don't have to worry about the fallout. It doesnt matter if the FDA falls apart and leads to massive food contamination when you only eat Wagyu beef from your private ranch. People will die, you pay less taxes, and you only see it as a success.

There are many other critiques to be made, but this is just the surface.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#322

Post by dimal »

curt15 wrote: post #186
jaybrendansmith wrote: post #11

As Americans that believe in the Republic, what exactly are we supposed to do about this? Should we continue to implore congress to take action against this lawless behavior?

First, don't listen to the "we're so f*cked" posts on reddit. Only actions lead to results. If you are a Republican but don't approve of how the GOP majority has basically rolled over and abdicated its duty as a check on the president, remind your congresspeople that they owe loyalty to their constituents, not to other politicians. Taxpayers pay their salaries. The Democratic party is also in desperate need of repair…

I am furious at the Democratic Party for bringing this about. They are the only organization capable of losing to this guy TWICE. With everything at stake, they actually thought it was a good idea to put up an unpopular president who had dementia, and tried to sneak him past the electorate like this is Weekend at Bernie’s 3. Then when that idea collapses, they just give it to the default next person in line. This should have been an easy win.

They got us here. The party needs to be gutted.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#323

Post by jsbisviewtiful »

jokoon wrote: post #279
Zamaamiro wrote: post #258

This EO, combined with his proclamation that "He who saves the country does not violate any law" paint a very concerning picture. This has, historically speaking, been the language of tyrants. No President is above the law, nor does the President "interpret" the law; that is the domain of the Judiciary. “Wherever law ends, tyranny begins”

[flagged]

> and I am not really worried that he might do a lot of damage

"His" "policy" of firing a large portion of the federal workforce is going to come crashing into the private sector very shortly when it comes time to renew contracts. That's not even mentioning what's about to happen to the job market when the unemployment rate skyrockets all at once and the private sector only has low income positions to offer - or none at all. Republicans are flirting with defaulting on US debt too, which will damage the value of USD - catastrophic when he's throwing tariffs around like confetti. That people keep posting things like "I'm not too worried" is mind-boggling. That's _only_ discussing the financial disaster to the economy and not the plethora of other problems Republicans are signing off on.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#325

Post by jmull »

doctorpangloss wrote: post #304
jmull wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It works for red China, why not the USA too? BTW, it's not Trump we're going to have to worry about. It's the next guy, who will have Trump imprisoned or executed for treason. This one won't be a blunderer, though, and will seize these levers of control much more firmly and competently.

Stephen Miller worked the DHS and HHS the way you described in the first Trump administration. Presumably Biden had ample time to “seize these levers” no?

Don't fall for the "us vs. them" distraction. This is about seizing power, not Democrats and Republicans.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#326

Post by claar »

buttercraft wrote: post #274
dkobia wrote: post #128

This new administration lays bare what we've known all along - the legislative gridlock and dysfunction in the house of representatives and senate has made them completely incapable of governing -- the least productive in a generation. This is opened up an opportunity for a well funded strongman, and the checks and balances that were intended to protect our democracy are now mere suggestions.

> legislative gridlock and dysfunction Isn't this a direct result of "no compromise" policies on one side of the aisle?

I recently watched a 2 hour congressional committee session, with 5 minute talking points per member. BOTH sides of the aisle used their entire 5 minutes to spout one-sided rhetoric and talking points obviously designed for re-election rather than anything resembling debate or conversation.

I have no idea which side "started it", but where we've landed isn't useful.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#327

Post by axus »

Zamaamiro wrote: post #258

This EO, combined with his proclamation that "He who saves the country does not violate any law" paint a very concerning picture. This has, historically speaking, been the language of tyrants. No President is above the law, nor does the President "interpret" the law; that is the domain of the Judiciary. “Wherever law ends, tyranny begins”

The Supreme Court literally said that Trump has absolute immunity for criminal use of presidential power. Combined with the statistical impossibility of a 2/3 senate majority for impeachment, this is a license to grab as much power as that same court will allow.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#328

Post by kasey_junk »

noah_buddy wrote: post #302
kasey_junk wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He’s scared of them. If he were to mess with the Fed it would impact Wall Street, particularly by making the market indices go down. For whatever reason he cares about that in ways he doesn’t care about his approval ratings or the historical norms of the office. See how fast he reached a deal on tariffs earlier in the month when the markets reacted to them? Since then they’ve been slowly leading tariffs to get the me…

His approval rating is quite high considering the circumstances. Will take months to really understand, but at least half of America abhors the federal government.

The only president with approval ratings lower than his current rating, this early in their presidency, was his own first term: https://news.gallup.com/poll/116677/presidential-approval-ra...

And its dropping from the low point it started at https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/favorability/dona...

I don't know what "considering the circumstances" are but his approval ratings are historically abysmal, not quite high.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#329

Post by bigbacaloa »

exe34 wrote: post #249
lazide wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s why the current administration is going to make sure the other side doesn’t get in power again.

I'm debating on whether they will manage to stir up enough chaos to suspend the constitution, or whether there will be enough independent thought left in the military to oust them when the time comes for new elections - although I can't rule out Russian-style elections, one-man one-vote, and his vote is what counts.

If you have to count on the military to save you, you are lost already.

Re: "Ensuring Accountability for All Agencies" – Executive Order

#330

Post by twoodfin »

snowwrestler wrote: post #170
grandempire wrote: post #30

The only rebuttal I see in the media is that congress set these up to be “independent”. But our government doesn’t have independent branches. In fact that sounds a lot like “unelected and unaccountable”. So which branches are these agencies under? Is it in the judicial, legislative, or executive - and if it’s in the executive why can’t the chief executive manage business? On the other hand, one of the issues brought…

If your question is whether the “independent” agencies are Constitutional, the answer is yes. Congress makes the laws and the laws can constrain the behavior of the President. If the law says the President cannot fire someone, or interfere in an agency’s work, then the President cannot. So who are such agencies accountable to? Congress. Just like the president is accountable to Congress.

This is just flatly incorrect. Humphrey's Executor (which may not be long for this world as precedent, anyway) lays out specific cases where "for cause" requirements on termination are Constitutional, but otherwise the President's power to dismiss subordinate officers of the executive branch is absolute.
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