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In Defense of Y'All

texasmonthly.com

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Re: In Defense of Y'All

#321

Post by ddingus »

cpburns2009 wrote: post #230
parpfish wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a native midwesterner, I get more annoyed and defensive than I should when people complain that “you guys” isnt gender neutral. Where I come from, everyone is “a guy”. It can mean “male person”, but that’s only if you use it in specific contexts that brings up gender (like saying “guys and gals”).

I don't think people outside the midwest understand just how ubiquitous "you guys" is here. After a previous time this discussion occurred on HN, I had to chuckle to myself when I heard my sister address a group of little girls as "you guys". It's our version of "y'all".

Yep. When I first encountered it years ago, that was my take. You'll for Midwesterners. Cool.

Well, I mooched it, and have seen it propagate here in the Northwest. Will not be long before it takes more general hold as we exchange people.

I seem to be bumping into it here (PDX) area more these days.

My favorite bit in all this is:

"All Y'all" which is simply plural for "Y'all", plus a subtle bit of familiarity state info.

If everyone is close, in agreement, likely to act as one, then "y'all" works for single as well as multiple people.

All y'all gets invoked when the group has differences. Maybe a few couples, or some people are new, or may be disagreeable in some way.

English is a lot of fun, because it allows for a very robust ad-hoc communication. Over time, the lexicon is never dull!

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#322

Post by mitthrowaway2 »

ppierald wrote: post #14

I like "Hi Team". I do use that in certain social circles, but I do get the point of the article. Survivor, the US TV show, used to say "Come on in guys" until recently where they made a point to discuss the topic on camera with the contestants. There was a variety of opinions, but they ultimately settled on "Come on in." which conveys the point in a neutral tone.

"Team" makes sense when addressing... well, your team, like if you're in a huddle of basketball players. But there are many contexts where it doesn't make sense as a general purpose second person plural.

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#323

Post by AlotOfReading »

pessimizer wrote: post #296
ternnoburn wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't "folx" lingo or jargon? Like, let me explain a bit... Just like "shade", "tea", and other queer lingo that was predominantly used within the queer community, "folx" was originally (in recent usage) a term that was used by some queer folk as a signal to indicate safety and inclusiveness. But like "shade", some outsiders heard that jargon and started using it in communities where it wasn't common, and didn't carr…

These are all black American words, not "queer lingo." Other than "folks" which is Southern, but comes to upper-middle class white people through Obama's act of pretending he had ever met black Americans before college at UCLA. They come from the long tradition of gay men copying black American female mannerisms, not anything "queer." > I suspect the real "villains" here to you are the folk who pull that jargon out a…

Since when is "folks" limited to black Americans? It was being heard in households across America for 50 years from Loony Tunes and the news.

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#324

Post by Aloha »

spondylosaurus wrote: post #265
cpburns2009 wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think people outside the midwest understand just how ubiquitous "you guys" is here. After a previous time this discussion occurred on HN, I had to chuckle to myself when I heard my sister address a group of little girls as "you guys". It's our version of "y'all".

Midwest? I thought it was just a West Coast thing! (Also extremely ubiquitous in SoCal.)

SoCal it can also be replaced with dude/dudes

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#325

Post by kazinator »

"Y'all" is a highly intelligent contribution to the English language, which underscores the folly of having deprecated "thou". English has plurals engrained in its DNA; it resists changes that make it a plural-free language.

Only a few words lack plural expression, like the words fish and sheep, or words that are inherently plural like pants, scissors or people.

Since thou has become severely archaic, invoked only in religious contexts or ironic contexts parodying religious speech, you has become a plural-free word like fish.

And that don't sit well with them Texans and other such folk.

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#326

Post by neom »

pessimizer wrote: post #299
radlad wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd hardly call Red Lobster formal. "Red Lobster Hospitality, LLC is an American casual dining restaurant chain," according to Wikipedia.

Any interaction a 16 year old employee has with a group of strange women who are customers and are older than him should be respectful.

That manner of social formality set sail a good 25 years ago my friend. On one hand I find it a shame, it was useful, on the other, it was also often misused (still exists in Korea where I now live, and it's abused like crazy here).

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#327

Post by cameronh90 »

forgotusername6 wrote: post #67
gregw2 wrote: post #11

I tease non-Texans that Texan English is actually superior to normal American English because it supports second-person plural via "Y'all" exactly as mentioned in this article... "you guys" is, to some ears, sexist, and "youse guys" (a New York-ism) is a little too old-school Italian. English lost its second person plural when we switched from Thou (second person singular formal + Thee=second person singular informal…

People in some parts of the UK say "yous" for second person plural. So it isn't quite gone.

We do on the West Coast of Scotland at least.

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#328

Post by jancsika »

gregw2 wrote: post #11

I tease non-Texans that Texan English is actually superior to normal American English because it supports second-person plural via "Y'all" exactly as mentioned in this article... "you guys" is, to some ears, sexist, and "youse guys" (a New York-ism) is a little too old-school Italian. English lost its second person plural when we switched from Thou (second person singular formal + Thee=second person singular informal…

> "Abandon hope all y'all (was: ye) who enter here!"

I'll be the HN troglodyte who loves to build from first principles:

Why not just "Abandon hope all who enter here?"

Does that leave humanity open to lawsuits from corvids or something?

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#329

Post by justin66 »

Onawa wrote: post #273
cpburns2009 wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think people outside the midwest understand just how ubiquitous "you guys" is here. After a previous time this discussion occurred on HN, I had to chuckle to myself when I heard my sister address a group of little girls as "you guys". It's our version of "y'all".

My first job was as a host at Red Lobster. I was reprimanded for saying "How are you guys doing today?" as I was seating a group of ladies. 16-year old me was trying my best to be polite, but language changes over time and that was one of my first introductions to code switching.

> I was reprimanded for saying "How are you guys doing today?" as I was seating a group of ladies.

By one of the ladies, or by a manager who overheard you?

Re: In Defense of Y'All

#330

Post by justin66 »

parpfish wrote: post #243
JasserInicide wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a sentiment that's only come up in the past 15 years. Same with the "Latinx" bullshit (that white people came up with)

latinx is nothing compared to "folx"

Latinx is a thing that's at least debated, if not widely used.

I've never seen "folx."

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