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A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

arstechnica.com

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Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#321

Post by johnnyanmac »

fn-mote wrote: post #310
johnnyanmac wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> hemmed and hawed for several weeks over whether to email a reprimand to that Doctor's manager, but ultimately decided it wouldn't do any good. Why? I feel I'd at least want that on the record even if the manager chooses to do nothing. Given what you're saying sounds so blantalty off course and not just some honest mistake.

> Why? I feel I'd at least want that on the record [...] What makes you think there is even a "record"? People are choosing not to complain in these situations because they have a belief that it will have no effect. If there were any record of negative effects for the "perpetrators", it might be different.

Not a formal record. But let's say, a malpractice lawsuit comes in. They audit emails and see this evaluation, likely ignored.

It's a long shot, but it could help in surprising ways. I'd only not send it if there was fear of retaliation.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#322

Post by deepfriedchokes »

xyclos wrote: post #35
wing-_-nuts wrote: post #2

I went to a new dentist when I was 18 because my other dentist was unavailable. He declares that I have two cavities and fills one, but doesn't use enough anesthetic. Given my bad exp with him I went back to my other dentist who's flabbergasted that there was supposedly a cavity on the other tooth. No sign of any decay. These kind of experiences are why I try to vet a new dentist very hard before trusting them, even…

When I was 12, I was scheduled by my regular dentist to have two cavities filled. It was the first time I had anything negative in a dental checkup. We were very poor, so my dad was pissed that it was going to be almost $400 to get them filled. He found a different dentist that was supposed to be a bit cheaper, and I went to that one instead. He was shocked to hear that I had been scheduled for two fillings. Since I…

You’d think they were breaking a law or something, recommending unnecessary medical procedures.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#323

Post by charlie0 »

mmooss wrote: post #271
nosianu wrote: post #268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That reminds me of this 2020 study of dentists in Switzerland, previously discussed on HN in January 2023: HN: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34322194 Study: "Health Services as Credence Goods: a Field Experiment" -- https://academic.oup.com/ej/article-abstract/130/629/1346/57... (full study available on SciHub) [Note: Credence goods are goods whose qualities cannot be ascertained by consumers even after purcha…

> we find significantly fewer overtreatment recommendations for patients with higher socio-economic status compared with lower socio-economic status for standard visits Very interesting: You'd think they'd go for the deeper pockets, but something overrides that.

The lower economic classes are often less educated and may have government issued insurance, so they much more likely to just take the treatment recommendations.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#324

Post by charlie0 »

matwood wrote: post #253
tcbawo wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also applies to several other competitive industries with asymmetric information — auto repair, plumbing, and HVAC come to mind. Consumers have to place their trust in someone. It always pays to be an informed consumer. Sometimes, I guess you have to pick and choose your battles.

Don't get me started on HVAC and plumbing. Two things that save me is I'm cheap and I don't mind a bit of suffering. My HVAC went out a couple of months ago. I diagnosed it like I would any other problem and settled on the blower fan probably went out. I call a place and guy comes out. He tested it and sure enough, broken fan. Now we get on the phone with his boss - they could do a new system on Monday (it was Friday…

Part of the problem is that in the US, everything cost about 2x+ as much as you would think and the reason why is taxes. Being self-employed means you pay almost 40% of all earnings in taxes. When I hear a quote, I take ~10% and estimate that's the cost of the parts and I can fix it myself. One problem with this though is that some thing require specialized tools to fix. Unless you can borrower them, it's not worth buying them for a one off repair.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#325

Post by havan_agrawal »

jt2190 wrote: post #203
yardie wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This whole post is about dentists recommending unnecessary treatment. And that has been our experience. She never had all these issues when she was seeing her dentist in her own country. But a few years in the US and her teeth are practically falling apart. Is it possible her previous dentist with no financial incentive found nothing wrong with her, yet the new one who is trying to make next quarters profit has every…

Find out if dentists are trained and licensed the same way in your wife’s home country as they are in the U.S.

This feels like a particularly derogatory take on the OP's wife's home country, which is ironic given that TFA is about "horrendous dentistry" in the US. Literal comment from the article

"Dentists are not required to learn how to place implants in dental school, nor are they required to complete implant training before performing the surgery in nearly all states."

"I was frankly stunned at how bad some of these dentists were practicing,” Prisby said. “It was horrendous dentistry."

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#328

Post by potato3732842 »

hansonkd wrote: post #31

This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…

Any business that is making big investments in things outside the "critical path" that can't be well justified is suspect.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#329

Post by MBCook »

mankyd wrote: post #245
MBCook wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You’re right, there’s a history. The reason I remember (I don’t know which of us or both are right) is that modern doctors came out of the “medical”/healing specialty where as dentists came out of the barber/surgeon tradition. So I believe doctors didn’t want to admit their inferiors (barbers who pull teeth) to the profession and so that’s why dentists were kept out. Overtime they’ve both grown in parallel since they…

I did a bit more digging and think I might have gotten the story a tiny bit muddled, but maybe not? Most the articles I find talk about the barber vs doctor distinction, but they also all bring up a story about a proposal to add dentistry to the University of Maryland's medical school. Evidently this proposal was put before the state legislature, was rejected, and thus was born the Baltimore College of Dentistry. Fro…

Interesting. Thanks for following up.

Very weird to think it was a decision by a legislature that set that path going forward.

I guess I had just assumed it was some kind of professional medical association that decided it.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#330

Post by jt2190 »

havan_agrawal wrote: post #325
jt2190 wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Find out if dentists are trained and licensed the same way in your wife’s home country as they are in the U.S.

This feels like a particularly derogatory take on the OP's wife's home country, which is ironic given that TFA is about "horrendous dentistry" in the US. Literal comment from the article "Dentists are not required to learn how to place implants in dental school, nor are they required to complete implant training before performing the surgery in nearly all states." "I was frankly stunned at how bad some of these denti…

The whole article is about whether a “dentist” is qualified to place implants by performing oral surgery. [1] The coloquial term “dentist” does not actually carry information about what procedures an individual is qualified to perform. Trying to compare “dentists” from different countries with different training and regulatory regimes without getting into the specifics of what those trainings and regulations are is going to mislead you to false equivalence.

[1] In the U.S. the basic DMD/DDS is referred to as a “dentist” but does not perform implant surgery. At minimum that would require extra training. The article is extremely sloppy about clarifying what qualifications the individuals who performed the procedures on Becky Carroll have. We don’t know if those individuals were unqualified or qualified and practicing poorly.

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