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Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

nytimes.com

321–330 of 599 posts

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#321
post #256

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One way to think about it is via the concept of body autonomy/sovereignty: your life is in your hands. IMHO dignified peaceful suicide should be a right granted to all free individuals. If one is free to live, why is one not free to die? But that is too radical of an idea, and upsets all sorts of people (especially the money men) Sometimes opting out is the only rational choice. If there is no support in society for…

Suicides do not just happen due to being in extreme, incurable pain. People commit suicides due to emotions which seem powerful immediately(failure in love life, academics, career etc.) but would not seem as such a big deal if they were to look back on it afterwards either due to the passing of time or due to finding something else which made life worthwhile. This also is the problem with the autonomy argument - this…

Sometimes suicides are not due to emotions, but facts. Please do not assume emotionality or irrationality on the part of those who do it or consider it.

Source: I am a man who has, and is, "falling through the cracks" as a child abuse victim with multiple disabilities, no hot job skills, and a marginalized identity.

My life is slipping away and I'm almost 40. I am an extremely suboptimal individual as far as capitalism is concerned. The passage of time has only cemented this very real and very grim outlook.

The "powerful state officials" are already doing what you fear they might do, and have been doing it for longer than I've been alive. They do it with prisons or under terms like "austerity" of "welfare queens" or "dole moochers"

Disabled people are treated like garbage. Look to the USA or UK for immediate examples.

"Aktion T4" never went away, it just got privatized.

There is no support or viable path forward for people like me, short of going on Social Security Disability and living in basically a slum if I'm lucky. Honestly If something like MAID was available, I would absolutely take it.

No, I am not irrational or acutely suicidal. No, I do not need some hotline. My upbringing and disability has taught me exactly how society views me over the course of decades. No, touching grass isn't going to solve it.

I have a partner and a job (for now). Partner understands what I'm going through, and is also marginalized and partially disabled, in a dead-end job, also circling the drain.

I was writing about myself and others I know in the same boat.

Go talk to some disabled people and otherwise marginalized people (due to skin color, sexual orientation, neurodivergence, disability, etc. -- often several overlapping things) who are clinging by their nails to the workforce. You'll find many similar stories.

Many of us are gone already. Many of my friends are gone or on their way out (homelessness, etc).

The kind of comprehensive help we need simply isn't there. We disappear quietly. You don't see us go, and we are not noticed or missed by anyone except our immediate circle or whatever community we can cobble together.

Seriously, go talk to people. You'll find that this is a common but unspoken thing.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#322
post #217

> Much of what is categorized as post-traumatic stress disorder may actually be caused by repeated exposure to blasts. that is to say, it's actually shell shock? as in, actual physical shock from actual shells? george carlin would be so proud https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuEQixrBKCc the article also mentions that they'd all trained extensively in diving deep underwater, which is also known to cause brain damage, b…

> diving deep underwater, which is also known to cause brain damage

never heard about that. can you back this up with a source or explanation?

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#323
post #6

This is the kind of research I've been yearning to see on suicide. Just telling people not to, or to call a hotline, seemed like the worst most patronizing advice as it never solved the underlying thing. I've since learned that there is a subset of suicidal people where that's enough, where the suicidal tendency is a kneejerk decision that can be disrupted, but it bugged me that its not serving everyone that becomes…

One way to think about it is via the concept of body autonomy/sovereignty: your life is in your hands. IMHO dignified peaceful suicide should be a right granted to all free individuals. If one is free to live, why is one not free to die? But that is too radical of an idea, and upsets all sorts of people (especially the money men) Sometimes opting out is the only rational choice. If there is no support in society for…

> why is one not free to die?

For the very simple reasons: it costs money and resources to grow up (and to die), and it’s a life that capitalism could’ve otherwise maybe used.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well the good thing they went forward back then and invented the modern helmet to protect people in trenches from overhead explosions. And incredibly it seems that the Adrian helmet still outperforms modern helmet designs in the blast protection quality. [1] It can't stop a bullet sure, but I suspect that chances of being hit by an overhead blast are higher than that a of a headshot in a typical warfare scenario. [1]…

FYI, also modern helmets are not designed to stop bullets but rather to protect from shrapnel and hand grenades. Stopping a bullet would mean breaking the wearers neck. (The kinetic energy needs to go somewhere after all.)

The bullet's kinetic energy is absorbed by the deformation and fragmentation of the projectile, the deformation of the helmet shell, the deformation/compression of rigid helmet pads, and conversion to heat.

The momentum of a projectile impact is very low, far lower than head contacts in sports. See, e.g.: https://i.ibb.co/7X6YCLD/ballistic-head-impact-updated.jpg -- from https://nap.nationalacademies.org/read/13390/chapter/9

If your helmet stops a bullet, there's some risk of head injury if the helmet shell, upon deformation, comes into contact with your skull. Otherwise you'll be okay. There's some historical information on this at: https://www.ade.pt/bulletproof-helmets

Also, the kinetic energy of a fragment near the site of an explosion can be higher than the kinetic energy load of a 9mm handgun bullet, which is generally the only small-arms threat that combat helmets are rated to stop.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In WW1, they called it "shell shock" for soldiers incapacitated without obvious injury. In WW2 it was called "battle fatigue", and now TBI. It seems the WW1 doctors got it right the first time.

What? Shell shock is PTSD. The doctors were concerned about concussive trauma but investigated and ruled it out as the cause. The concern itself was right to have, but I don't think the concern has ever gone away. So I don't characterize that as very "right the first time".

I doubt they had the right technology back then to actually investigate for physical brain trauma. Even today CTE diagnoses are made post mortem. And one can end up with CTE without ever having a full blown concussion.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#326

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm unaware of any war over the last 100 years between conventional forces that didn't involve trench warfare Anything involving modern combined-arms warfare. Iraq, for example.

I'm being a bit unfair in that I'm counting hesco as a kind of trench warfare, but you're right in that that doesn't exactly apply on 'patrol' Still, I believe earthen barriers are still used to solidify the 'frontlines' if you squint a bit Afaik the Iraq Iran war was still doing straight up trench warfare (at points) and the Syrian civil war + Afghan theater were using caves (in some areas). Same with Korea and Viet…

> the Iraq Iran war was still doing straight up trench warfare (at points) and the Syrian civil war + Afghan theater were using caves (in some areas)Same with Korea and Vietnam

Static versus combined arms. The U.S. military is deadly not only because it is big, but also because it practically invented and then mastered modern combined-arms warfare. (It’s why we put so much emphasis on air superiority over e.g. armour.)

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Historically, the rationale for excluding women from the draft was that they weren't eligible to serve in combat roles, voluntarily or otherwise Historically countries didn't let women fight in wars because they didn't want their civilisation to die out. If a country loses a double-digit percent of its men it can still repopulate just as quickly, because one man can make multiple women pregnant, while if it loses it…

> Historically countries didn't let women fight in wars because they didn't want their civilisation to die out. No, women have been excluded from front-line combat because they are physically weaker than men and would be killed quickly without accomplishing much. Men are just much more aggressive, have higher stamina etc. It's never been about repopulation. Nothing biologically stops a woman having 10 children with a…

Israel tried it some time ago. I don't agree women are weak per se, yes their peak in strength and stamina are lower as proven by literally any professional athletic sport, but this doesn't matter that much as before in current combat.

What went wrong - in fubar situations, men instinctively lunged for protecting women, instead of rationally estimating situation and acting accordingly. We men are simply still too much gentlemen to have women around when bullets are flying, despite feminists trying hard erasing this. Give it 2 more generations and western society will be there.

FYI eastern Europe countries like Ukraine have women in the military, including combat positions. Not surprisingly they keep getting injured and dying just like rest of them.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why not outlaw all violence? Replace it with hugs.

Go try some violence and get back to us.

You try gun violence first.

* to quit with the games, relatively moderm firearms are 1700-1800's tech, with things like 3D printing banning them is as nonsensical as banning alcohol. Its just too easy to make.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#329
post #320

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fertility rates do not decrease after a war, which means fewer remaining men get the same number of women pregnant.

From a sibling comment, in Russia fertility rates did indeed decrease: https://direct.mit.edu/rest/article-abstract/99/2/229/58403/...

Because so many civilians died, including women, and harsh living conditions due to wide spread destruction.

Re: Pattern of brain damage is pervasive in Navy SEALs who died by suicide

#330

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Historically, the rationale for excluding women from the draft was that they weren't eligible to serve in combat roles, voluntarily or otherwise Historically countries didn't let women fight in wars because they didn't want their civilisation to die out. If a country loses a double-digit percent of its men it can still repopulate just as quickly, because one man can make multiple women pregnant, while if it loses it…

> Historically countries didn't let women fight in wars because they didn't want their civilisation to die out. No, women have been excluded from front-line combat because they are physically weaker than men and would be killed quickly without accomplishing much. Men are just much more aggressive, have higher stamina etc. It's never been about repopulation. Nothing biologically stops a woman having 10 children with a…

> Nothing biologically stops a woman having 10 children with a single man, it's just rare.

You'll have to forgive me for finding this non-explanation unsatisfying. Do you think there's any reason for it being "rare"?

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