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Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

arstechnica.com

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Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#321

Post by realusername »

neverokay wrote: post #318
realusername wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> You may be not be aware of or simply have forgotten ever visiting a friend or family’s computer where all kinds of AskJeeeves toolbars are installed from god knows where. And how are you going to make those OS-wide popups with the iOS sandbox exactly? Be sure that if apps could make it, they already would, appstore reviews or not. There's some very strange communication on Apple side saying simultaneously that thei…

I’ve seen tracking apps that prompt the user to enable a vpn on iOS so all their traffic is routed through them (this was not a vpn app, this was a user tracking app - not malicious. Now imagine a malicious one that doesn’t go through App Store review). The vpn thing on iOS is concerning. The user may not even know or remember they allowed it and it could just be sitting on their phone indefinitely. I’d like it if Ap…

Even on the web, those are blocked with a malware list, I'm not sure that's the best argument for the appstore.

The contribution of the review here (which this kind of malware would easily pass with a server side trigger anyways) doesn't seem that important.

I don't think Apple should restrict which VPN can go though anyways just because of the privacy issues in a lot of dictatorships, they're aren't the best party to do that and are subject to dubious requests, as seen as in China or Russia.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#322

Post by Kirby64 »

ajdude wrote: post #319
rickdeckard wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe it's simply more lucrative to keep selling both devices to the same target group, than try to solve the users' problem with a single device. Everything in Apple is designed to silo off the two product groups. An "iPad with MacOS" would just shift revenue from the MacOS division to the iPad division, losing a MacOS customer and probably NOT gaining a iPad customer (as he would have purchased an iPad anyway).…

This is the same reason behind the Apple Pencil not working on the iPhone. Despite the iPhone approaching sizes of an iPad mini, I can't use the incredibly expensive pencil on an iPhone because according to Apple only the iPad should be used for tablet stuff.

What? The Apple Pencil works because there’s a special digitizer layer on the screen for pencil compatible devices that allows it to work. This isn’t included on the iPhone. Same reason a Samsung S-Pen doesn’t work on devices that don’t support it.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#323

Post by shepherdjerred »

DCKing wrote: post #67

The iPad App Store is perhaps an even more dysfunctional place than the iPhone in how much it holds hardware and use cases hostage to the manufacturer's vision. Just imagine how much more versatile the iPad Pro would be if only you could run Linux VMs on it in the moments you want to do anything remotely tinkery on an iPad. Apple's hardware since the 2021 iPad Pro (with M1) has had the ability to do this. The iPads h…

I've been so confused about Apple advertising the capabilities of the M1 iPad -- it's got a _real_ processor, it's so fast!

...but nothing on the iPad can _really_ use it.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#324

Post by rickdeckard »

latexr wrote: post #303
richrichardsson wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not so sure. From mid-to-late 90s onwards a mobile phone was basically an essential item. I was never tempted to buy an iPod, but combine the phone and iPod and give me internet access to boot... sold.

> I was never tempted to buy an iPod, but combine the phone and iPod and give me internet access to boot... sold. Before the iPhone there were already phones which could play music and access the web. I even remember some Motorolas which interacted directly with iTunes. The iPhone didn’t succeed just by smooshing those together. Either way, that’s neither here nor there, the point is precisely that Apple didn’t shy a…

I don't know how it is relevant what Apple did on other products, especially "pre-iPhone".

The point is that TODAY the PC line and the iPad line of Apple are quite notable silo'ed to very specific usage-patterns.

There is no technical reason for that, but the distinct commercial reason that there is nothing to gain in terms of revenue or profit by combining the two products into one.

They both sell fine and at great margin separately, there is little to gain by building an iPad Pro that is 2000 USD and supports the use-cases of both a 600 USD iPad and a 1600 USD MacBook respectively.

Quite bluntly: You want the iPad to be convenient in a workflow as far as possible, and then SUCK really bad in a way only a fully synchronized Macbook can fix.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#325

Post by rickdeckard »

Kirby64 wrote: post #322
ajdude wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is the same reason behind the Apple Pencil not working on the iPhone. Despite the iPhone approaching sizes of an iPad mini, I can't use the incredibly expensive pencil on an iPhone because according to Apple only the iPad should be used for tablet stuff.

What? The Apple Pencil works because there’s a special digitizer layer on the screen for pencil compatible devices that allows it to work. This isn’t included on the iPhone. Same reason a Samsung S-Pen doesn’t work on devices that don’t support it.

I think the technical reason why the Pencil doesn't work is beside the point here.

Apple is building the hardware, and they decide that the Pencil use-case a iPhone user may have shall not be covered by buying an Apple Pencil, but by buying an iPad (and a Apple Pencil)

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#326

Post by talldayo »

shuckles wrote: post #309
user_7832 wrote: post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's hard to imagine how a working developer can believe that maintaining a platform where anyone can do anything has only upfront fixed costs. Isn't that how Google Play Store works? $25 once, for life. Presumably revenue is from IAPs and ads.

The Play Store has similar fees for IAP and sales as Apple. When people complain about Apple charging developers, it’s not about the $100 annual cost of the developer program.

They aren't complaining about the 30% either; they simply want a way to compete with what the App Store charges for. Android provides that, iOS does not.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#327

Post by Kirby64 »

rickdeckard wrote: post #325
Kirby64 wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What? The Apple Pencil works because there’s a special digitizer layer on the screen for pencil compatible devices that allows it to work. This isn’t included on the iPhone. Same reason a Samsung S-Pen doesn’t work on devices that don’t support it.

I think the technical reason why the Pencil doesn't work is beside the point here. Apple is building the hardware, and they decide that the Pencil use-case a iPhone user may have shall not be covered by buying an Apple Pencil, but by buying an iPad (and a Apple Pencil)

The technical reason is important, though. If it was totally free I suspect they’d allow it to function, but it doesn’t… so burdening the 200M iPhones with the additional cost of the pencil hardware is a trade off not worth taking. Just like Samsung not “allowing” S-pen to work on most of the phones since adding the digitizer element would be a silly cost adder, especially for their super cheap phones.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#328

Post by trogdor »

nehal3m wrote: post #272
skhunted wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the large Apple Watch. It has cell capabilities. I wish it was a standalone device. I don’t need a phone. The cellular watch could replace my phone if Apple allowed standalone devices. I doubt they will ever allow people to have a cellular watch without being tied to a phone.

I also have a cellular Watch. Combined with some AirPods it works great if all you need is phonecalls which is a good use case if you want to be available without a time sucking little monster in your pocket.

I think their point was that you have to pair Apple Watch with an iPhone in order to use cellular, and they wish you could use cellular Apple Watch without having to own an iPhone.

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#329

Post by trogdor »

skydhash wrote: post #271
Rinzler89 wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>iPhone when you can simply ssh to a vm somewhere else? Like not having reliable internet access everywhere. In a lot of areas mobile internet is spotty. Or you're in roaming so it's insanely expensive. Plus we already have these powerful devices in out pocket, more powerful than PC's were 10 years ago, sitting idly doing nothing most of the time, why not put them to use when in need instead of paying for some extra…

While I agree with your use case, doing nothing most of the time is how those devices last day long on a battery and can run without a fan. My MBA get toasty when I OCR a pdf, I cannot imagine a phone on a sustained load.

>My MBA get toasty when I OCR a pdf

Apple silicon?

Re: Apple must open iPadOS to sideloading within 6 months, EU says

#330

Post by rcarmo »

fingerlocks wrote: post #282
rcarmo wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Been there, done that, gave up because it’s not a justifiable expense for individual use. Wrote a couple of Android apps instead but can't really use them daily.

Presumably you work in tech. Every employer I’ve ever had will reimburse my personal dev account fee as an educational expense. Have you tried asking?

I work at Microsoft. Next question :)
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