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Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

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Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#321

Post by throw10920 »

tpmoney wrote: post #318
throw10920 wrote: post #254

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone remotely familiar with operating system design can tell you that desktop and mobile operating systems have massive differences with respect to security. "macOS, Linux and Windows are not sufficiently "well-designed" OSes for this purpose" is exactly the case.

Ok, so what are the features missing from those OSes that iOS has that enable these anti-cheat capabilities and also that are also not dependent on Apple maintaining its strict control over what can and can't run on iOS?

A complete trusted boot chain, lack of third-party kernel modules, and remote attestation. Nothing runs in iOS kernel space without Apple saying so (which is NOT the case for desktop operating systems), which is a prerequisite for remote attestation (which iOS also supports).

None of these properties are compromised by allowing arbitrary user-space code, which is what is one of the parents thought would happen.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#322

Post by dotnet00 »

ribosometronome wrote: post #293
dotnet00 wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know many people who find themselves stuck in Apple's ecosystem since while they personally could switch out their computer and relearn everything, they can't really disrupt the things their older family are used to on other devices and expect them to relearn everything. Combined with Apple's love of walled gardens (and therefore very limited interoperability with other platforms), switching out would cause too muc…

>It's always kind of annoying seeing this "just don't use it" argument, as it completely ignores that part of the point of the walled garden is that it gradually forces people to be so invested in the garden that it becomes increasingly expensive to leave it. My personal experience doesn't leave me super convinced of this, which is why I asked. I don't think I use any apps I've purchased on the regular anymore. There…

I wouldn't say it's that they prefer it, as they have no concept of iOS or Android, nor Windows, MAC or Linux, they just care about if it's similar enough to what they've already painstakingly learned to use and deal with the quirks of.

What I'm referring to as a walled garden issue is that they've learned to use the "included" features like iCloud etc, those are walled in (ie using it on Android isn't as smooth). Thus when you switch away, you're expecting them to learn the new UI and to get used to different services (eg google drive) and their associated menus.

I suppose it's better described as vendor lock-in, similar to how before you could easily transfer your phone number between carriers, the number itself acted as a form of lock-in, if you used the number on anything important you were stuck with the number until you could get the number updated.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#323

Post by sunnybeetroot »

threeseed wrote: post #57
NoPedantsThanks wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how Apple thinks they're going to measure the transactions that take place. Simply clicking on the link and visiting the third-party-payment site doesn't prove anything, because the user could bail out before paying.

Because iOS apps talk to the Notarisation Service on launch. So they know total app installs as well as the installs purchased from the App Store.

App installs does not equal transactions.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#324

Post by NetOpWibby »

HatchedLake721 wrote: post #315
NetOpWibby wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LMAO MICROSOFT played the hugest part in Windows Phone demise. I still had a Palm Pre at the time and was waiting for a particular yellow Nokia Windows Phone to release for Sprint. My recollection is muddy after that but Windows Phone was no more so I got an iPhone.

Possibly, but at the time Windows Phones were snappier and often had better hardware than Android. For me, developers played a huge part. There were a lot of popular and new apps missing in the windows store. Microsoft had to even co-fund app developers to build apps for windows phone, without much luck or being too late. E.g. Instagram for Windows released 18 months after Android. Did YouTube ever release on windows…

> E.g. Instagram for Windows released 18 months after Android. Did YouTube ever release on windows phone?

You just unlocked a memory for me. I totally forgot that IG was never released for Windows Phone. Damn.

I rescind my previous comments, you're absolutely right. I think they could have a better go at it, this time. It's not Ballmer's Microsoft anymore (FWIW, I enjoyed aspects of his era).

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#325

Post by NetOpWibby »

cyberax wrote: post #217
NetOpWibby wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Again, who cares? I'm using the same messaging apps that I was using 10 years ago. One of my best friends who was using Allo. Or Duo. Or Hangouts. Or Meet. Or whatever. He really loved one of those apps and it got removed/changed/or something. My point was that as a developer, I'd want to ensure users like the platform they're on enough to buy my app. This same friend? He moved to some launcher and just uses Discor…

> My point was that as a developer, I'd want to ensure users like the platform they're on enough to buy my app. Android is the number 1 platform in the world. Except in the US, where Apple is manipulating teens using "blue bubbles".

> Apple is manipulating teens using "blue bubbles"

LOL WOW

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#326

Post by grishka »

heavyset_go wrote: post #179
grishka wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm talking about iOS apps specifically. Don't pretend that not making your app available for the second most popular mobile OS is acceptable.

In the US, iOS has the majority of the market share, so it is the first most popular mobile OS.

And in Japan iirc. In the rest of the world, though, the usual situation is around 2/3 Android and 1/3 iOS.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#327

Post by robertlagrant »

blibble wrote: post #110
robertlagrant wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hopefully the judge isn't like that. Bit of a silly character trait for a judge.

turns out courts don't like people treating them with contempt

Doesn't mean you get angry, though. Just judge and move on.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#328

Post by danbruc »

aurareturn wrote: post #242
danbruc wrote: post #130

The economy primarily exists to benefit the consumers, not the producers. With that in mind, I should be able to run any operating system on an iPhone I bought. Apple should not be required to actively support this, put in extra work to document things or whatnot, but they should not be allowed to actively make things harder. If I got an iOS license, I should be able to install and run any application and be able to…

With that in mind, I should be able to run any operating system on an iPhone I bought. Apple should not be required to actively support this, put in extra work to document things or whatnot, but they should not be allowed to actively make things harder. I should be able to run any OS on my Samsung TV that I bought. Samsung should support it with an SDK. They should provide warranty and support for me if the OS I chos…

No, I don't. I specifically said that they should not be required to actively support this, write and publish documentation or even provide a SDK. And I said nothing about providing warranty, replacing the operating system could just void the warranty. Again, I did not ask for active support, I asked for no active blocking, i.e. putting in extra work to block something that would naturally be possible.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#329

Post by robertlagrant »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #258
robertlagrant wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one is forced to sell on Apple either, if that's your logic.

The point is obviously that the app developer should be able to host the app themselves, or have some other third party do it who charges lower fees, not that Apple should have to do it for free. "Use Apple's store or those customers can't buy your app" is forcing people to sell on Apple.

No it's not. If Apple didn't exist, people wouldn't suddenly be freer. Developing for Apple, and the job of "mobile developer" they invented, are both choices.

Re: Apple's bad faith 27% tax on web purchases

#330

Post by robertlagrant »

jmole wrote: post #104
robertlagrant wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They do have competition. Most phones aren't iPhones.

Considering this case is in the USA, iPhones have a >53% market share and iPads >55%. But regardless of that, they have no competition in iOS app distribution. Keeping my fingers crossed that the EU will help solve that problem.

I doubt the EU has the mindset or ability to cultivate companies that are able to compete with Apple.
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