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Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

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Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#321

Post by bbarn »

raiyu wrote: post #149

Anyone else think this has nothing to do with the regulatory agencies but instead the market has dramatically shifted in the past 15 months in terms of valuations and this is a nice cover to cancel the deal? Figma still gets $1B "investment" without giving up any equity or control and Adobe gets to walk away from a massive $20B fee. Adobe makes $17B a year in revenue, they would need some pretty strong growth out of…

It's not completely implausible what you're getting at is right, even if your numbers don't quite make sense.

Consider also the fact - news of this merger was almost universally received poorly by Figma users. The internet was awash with "open source equivalents" - "You don't need Figma" articles, etc.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#322

Post by figassis »

_fat_santa wrote: post #301
jan_Inkepa wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also that their cancellation window has limits on both sides - I told them more than six months I advance to cancel my renewal and the refused and toll me to call up again in a particular 30 day period close to the expiry date...

When your business has to depend on subscription engineering like this, it means the underlying product is not good enough to stand on it's own feet.

It probably is, but rent seeking has no limits.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#323

Post by nolok »

danpalmer wrote: post #271
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

> Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices Great news, where do I testify? Adobe tried to bribe me personally to not fight their subscription cancellation policies for the company I was representing. Given how obviously unimpressed I was with the whole thing and how I was clearly not the target market of a creative cloud subscription, I can only assume that this is a policy that the…

Unless you have clear proof of that (saved emails...) and own the company, or you were acting as third party (consultant,...) I would advise not making those accusation in a public place without consulting with their legal representative. It is simply not in your personal interest, and if someone starts an inquiry into this and said company doesn't want to help much you might find yourself in the middle of two legal giants in need of a scapegoat.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#324

Post by pcurve »

danielvaughn wrote: post #281
pointlessone wrote: post #101

Figma got out better than it was before. It's still a strong product. And Adobe abandoned XD basically giving up this market to Figma.

I wonder what this does to their valuation? It's not really my area so I don't know, but once a company is willing to buy you at a certain price, you're kinda "worth" that price right?

There was only one company to which Figma was worth $20 billion and that was Adobe, because it was a long term threat.

I just hope Google or Msft doesn't get any funny idea to buy Figma.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#325

Post by srvmshr »

Erratic6576 wrote: post #14
jonplackett wrote: post #5

I don’t even use Figma, but I a glad Adobe won’t be owning them.

Yeah I miss Adobe Lightroom but you don’t get to install it, adobe takes over your computer

This part is so true. Adobe under-the-hood SWE feels so shoddy. It feels as if their products, although delivering the good, is strung up by different patchworks. And it spawns files & folders all over your system

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#326

Post by SirMaster »

spaceman_2020 wrote: post #210
madeofpalk wrote: post #6

Excellent news. I think there should be more products, more companies, and more competition. Adobe just buying up it's competition will only ever directly hurt consumers. See also, "Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices." https://www.theverge.com/2023/12/15/24003532/adobe-says-the-...

imo, Adobe is falling behind. Photoshop's generative AI is substantially worse than what I can get from models on Tensorart/CivitAI + an upscaler. It's way easier to produce something that can go live right now without much editing in CivitAI -> Upscale in Magnific -> Add to Canva.

>Photoshop's generative AI is substantially worse than what I can get from models on Tensorart/CivitAI + an upscaler.

But with Photoshops, I can generate things to be seamlessly placed into my existing scene, with it understanding things like placing the wheels of the car it just inserted on the ground, with a shadow underneath and such, again seamlessly integrated with my existing image.

It's very much not just about generating an entirely new AI image.

Can I do that with Tensorart/CivitAI?

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#327

Post by xbar »

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #213
DaiPlusPlus wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It certainly isn't good for Adobe It is good for Adobe: they'll be forced to make their products better. ...I hope!

>It is good for Adobe: they'll be forced to make their products bette Which they thought was harder than spending $20 billion acquiring a competitor.

Maybe it would be more accurate to say that they that there is no way for them to make a product that will steal Figma's market for less than $20 billion.

Adobe's despised reputation in business practices makes it hard for users to choose Adobe when any other creative option when it is available.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#328

Post by cartermatic »

JadoJodo wrote: post #218

While I do see this as great news (for all the reasons others have outlined), I wonder how this will impact VC in the future; If the current goal is for companies to get VC money, burn that cash for years and years and years, and then have a huge IPO or acquisition (that makes it all worth it), it would seem regulatory issues would start to scare away investment.

I think the door is still open for Microsoft, Google, Apple or Salesforce to make a play. Figma was rumored to have approached Microsoft during their talks with Adobe but Microsoft declined to put in an offer as they were working through the Activision Blizzard acquisition at the time. Either one could probably get a "deal" at a $10-$15b valuation.

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#329

Post by anthuswilliams »

dtx1 wrote: post #304
danpalmer wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices Great news, where do I testify? Adobe tried to bribe me personally to not fight their subscription cancellation policies for the company I was representing. Given how obviously unimpressed I was with the whole thing and how I was clearly not the target market of a creative cloud subscription, I can only assume that this is a policy that the…

Looking at your profile, it says you work for Google, so I assume this is in the context of google? You guys probably have the internal legal resources to advice you. If it was not in that context, ChatGPT at least suggest that this is first of all a federal fucking crime (Domestic Bribery Act seems to apply here) and you can contact the Department of Justice, the FBI or report it to the SEC which offers a whistleblo…

This sounds it might be like a hallucination. I've never heard of any "Domestic Bribery Act" and I'm unable to find one in cursory online searching. (In 18 USC there are prohibitions on bribing public officials, but that doesn't seem relevant here.)

Re: Figma and Adobe abandon proposed merger

#330

Post by danpalmer »

dtx1 wrote: post #304
danpalmer wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Adobe says the FTC is looking into its subscription cancellation practices Great news, where do I testify? Adobe tried to bribe me personally to not fight their subscription cancellation policies for the company I was representing. Given how obviously unimpressed I was with the whole thing and how I was clearly not the target market of a creative cloud subscription, I can only assume that this is a policy that the…

Looking at your profile, it says you work for Google, so I assume this is in the context of google? You guys probably have the internal legal resources to advice you. If it was not in that context, ChatGPT at least suggest that this is first of all a federal fucking crime (Domestic Bribery Act seems to apply here) and you can contact the Department of Justice, the FBI or report it to the SEC which offers a whistleblo…

This was several years ago in a different role before my current employer, and has nothing to do with my current employer. I agree that legal advice would have been good here, but to be honest I was just glad to cancel the subscriptions and move on with more important things. The company I worked for is sadly out of business now so wouldn't be a target of any action, and I stand by my comments in a personal capacity so have no wish to take them down currently, but thank you for the advice.

I wouldn't be (and am not) making this sort of accusation on behalf of any operating company without prior approval.

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