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The day Windows died

thomasbandt.com

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Re: The day Windows died

#321

Post by rekabis »

petilon wrote: post #258
localghost3000 wrote: post #167

I am sure I will get all kinds of hate for saying this: despite the extra up front cost, apple stuff is a better value. Lets take device lifetime: I have a 2013 MBP 15 and 2015 MBP 15. I use them for intensive things like music production. Both devices work flawlessly. I also a System 76 Oryx Pro which cost more than any mac I own. The webcam failed 5 months in, several keys don't work anymore, and it gets hotter tha…

> despite the extra up front cost, apple stuff is a better value What extra up front cost? The Macbook Air costs $799 at BestBuy. Do you mean to say a similar quality Windows machine costs less? Only Samsung makes computers that are comparable to the Macbook. This Samsung [2] arguably has a better screen but costs $1450. (There are cheaper Samsungs but they don't have 200% screen resolution.) [1] https://www.bestbuy.…

> What extra up front cost? The Macbook Air costs $799 at BestBuy.

Only if you go with the absolute lowest specs. Which means you cannot upgrade them and will have to chuck that MacBook Air much sooner than any Windows laptop because it’s unable to keep up with you.

Maxing out the specs on any Apple hardware is practically required for maximizing usable lifespan, and unfortunately, represents a massive barrier to entry for a majority of people. Since these products are not upgradable after the fact (as most Windows systems are), you have to choose between a much shorter expected lifespan or a much more expensive product.

For example, I can easily put together a Windows machine for $3,000 that can do much the same things that a $2,000 Mac Mini can. But get the entry-level Mac Mini, and any Windows machine which matches that price is relevant for more than twice the time span thanks to its ability to be upgraded.

Re: The day Windows died

#322

Post by erickhill »

KerrAvon wrote: post #312
acomjean wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who replaced a 2014 MacBook Pro with a system 76 oryx pro. The oryx does get warmer and has terrible battery life, but mine is currently 4 years and and working fine. It’s significantly faster than the mac (it’s newer) and can play games (it has a fairly decent video card). You can do unreal development on it. A more apt comparison would be that MacBook with a pangolin amd 5600? machine. It’s much better o…

The M1 MacBook Pro is the best Mac made since the turn of the century.

Hear hear.

I have a Macbook Pro M1 Max. I upgraded from a 2015 MBP, which had previously been one of my all-time favorite Apple laptops (and I've had cough a lot).

The MBP M1 Max - to my surprise - destroyed the 2015 on virtually every level.

This is my current "from my cold dead hands" machine.

Re: The day Windows died

#323

Post by AdeptusAquinas »

petilon wrote: post #318
AdeptusAquinas wrote: post #298

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm, I'd say the Surface line are the direct competitors, and have real nice quality. Better keyboards and a nicer screen form factor 3:2. Was quite a fan of the Surface Book 2, and recently picked up a Laptop Go which is great, for less than a Macbook Air.

Surface Laptop 5 costs $899. Still no sign of "extra up-front cost" of Apple. For me, Surface Laptop isn't even in the running because of poor screen resolution. The old Surface Book has 3000x2000 resolution which is 200%, but the Surface Laptops have 2256x1504 resolution, which is only 150%. As Steve Jobs said when he introduced iPhone 4, the only resolution that looks good after 100% is 200%. I have tested screens…

I think Mac and surfaces are in the same price bracket definitely. My surface book was a cool 4k in NZD when I grabbed it, comparative to a similar MacBook pro.

Re: The day Windows died

#324

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

nbzso wrote: post #307

Hostile personal computing is here to stay. Dark patterns are prerequisite for commercial OS nowadays. Outside the usual "work" scenario, there is no sane tech person who is not aware of this and is not using Linux. The idea that Macs are somehow better is obvious when installing Little Snitch. These are the data hoarders for the common people. My kid will know what is a terminal before it touches iPad or iPhone.

I think you are right. I don't know the real demographics, but anecdotally most buddies seem to have been looking into alternatives over the past few years. Some went for fancish Unraid, some various linux flavors, but very few actually stayed on Windows. Proton certainly helped as gaming stopped being a valid reason. I used to think my own jump will be harder, but, well, I now run Windows maybe once a quarter. One of those times is to file taxes.

Sadly, you are likely also right about the race to the bottom for the rest. Maybe it would be different if they cared, but they don't. I have tried to explain it to my wife many a time, but it was mostly a failure ( so now her new lappy runs decrappified Windows 10 ). Worse yet, the whole data economy has become ingrained. Just yesterday chick at a dealership joked to sign here so that everyone can get my phone number. After that, attended a birthday party, where host company had a provision in disclaimer that they can use any pictures captured on camera for their promotion should they so choose. I almost lost it. It has been normalized. And you can't even cross this shit out, because it is all 'standard form' on a PC and whatever teen is running the desk wouldn't give a shit even if they understood the issue.

It is funny. My kid loves keyboard. Maybe there is hope yet.

Re: The day Windows died

#325

Post by dysoco »

qbasic_forever wrote: post #166
BaculumMeumEst wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’ve run arch and gentoo for years, i’ll be setting up my kid with a mac unless he expresses extreme interest in the depths of linux. Learning linux trivia is misrepresented as virtuous and there are more useful things to do with your time.

When you're a kid it's precisely the time to learn about and deal with all the minutia. Tell them it's like Minecraft but you're building an operating system instead of a world.

Yeah obviously, but as long as the kid is interested in bulding an OS from the ground up, if he wants to do webdev, 3d design, music production, writing or whatever, it's just gonnna be an useless hassle.

And this comes from someone who spent a good amount of his teenage years toying with linux, arch, slackware, lfs, whatever. It was good fun but nowadays I think it was mostly useless and I'd rather had finished dev projects or whatever.

Re: The day Windows died

#326

Post by lannisterstark »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #218
lannisterstark wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tend not to see thinkpads for resale value, but I think they do fit with the "lasting the test of time" test. The parts are easily available, cheap, and virtually everything is user replaceable. It's great.

I had one once. I honestly thought it was awful.I respect that your experiences may have been different but I found it painfully slow and bulky. The detachable battery broke as well and had to be held in place by tape. I opened it once and it looked like a bunch of bits arranged to look like a laptop. Anyone who has seen the elegant neatness of the inside of a Mac will understand what I mean.

>elegant neatness of the inside of a Mac

I get your point but this is pretty irrelevant to many people who want the machine to work. Function over form or some such. I'd rather have a durable, repairable machine than a "pretty" machine that allows me virtually 0 upgrades or I have to eat the cost of hundreds of dollars every time I have to send it to Apple care.

The thonkpads I have are fairly repairable, durable, and fast. Yes, they're bulky but weight is generally not an issue for me.

Re: The day Windows died

#327

Post by grishka »

KerrAvon wrote: post #312
acomjean wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who replaced a 2014 MacBook Pro with a system 76 oryx pro. The oryx does get warmer and has terrible battery life, but mine is currently 4 years and and working fine. It’s significantly faster than the mac (it’s newer) and can play games (it has a fairly decent video card). You can do unreal development on it. A more apt comparison would be that MacBook with a pangolin amd 5600? machine. It’s much better o…

The M1 MacBook Pro is the best Mac made since the turn of the century.

The M1 Max MacBook is the best computer I've ever owned, period. I upgraded to it from a 2012 MBP. The hardware is top-notch (pun intended).

Re: The day Windows died

#328

Post by Nursie »

rekabis wrote: post #321
petilon wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> despite the extra up front cost, apple stuff is a better value What extra up front cost? The Macbook Air costs $799 at BestBuy. Do you mean to say a similar quality Windows machine costs less? Only Samsung makes computers that are comparable to the Macbook. This Samsung [2] arguably has a better screen but costs $1450. (There are cheaper Samsungs but they don't have 200% screen resolution.) [1] https://www.bestbuy.…

> What extra up front cost? The Macbook Air costs $799 at BestBuy. Only if you go with the absolute lowest specs. Which means you cannot upgrade them and will have to chuck that MacBook Air much sooner than any Windows laptop because it’s unable to keep up with you. Maxing out the specs on any Apple hardware is practically required for maximizing usable lifespan, and unfortunately, represents a massive barrier to ent…

This is not really true. While the base spec won't meet all needs, you don't need to max out the spec to get a usable machine with a long life.

Re: The day Windows died

#329

Post by lannisterstark »

Seb-C wrote: post #281
localghost3000 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. I own two. A t410 and a t450. Definitely more durable but no resale value. I use them for experimental linux installs these days.

My high-end thinkpad X1 carbon died after 2 years... Not repairable, and they don't sell any motherboard that could allow me to repair it myself. Also the CPU and RAM were soldered on it, which makes it even less repairable.

Yeah sadly that's what they've started doing with the X1 Carbon series. But T(xxx) series is still pretty solid. Not to mention older x(xxx) units are still great.

Re: The day Windows died

#330

Post by kccqzy »

joeman1000 wrote: post #122
qbasic_forever wrote: post #65

Setup your 10 year old with bleeding edge Arch Linux, add a script to automatically update nightly (or even hourly lol), and give them a secondary device like a tablet loaded up with access to arch wiki, every man page, etc. but nothing else. They will be an absolute Linux wizard in months and maybe a core contributor soon after.

Sounds like hell. They will quickly be turned away from Linux and want something simpler. Yak-shaving in lieu of work sounds cool, but it sucks when you really need to do stuff other than dick around in the terminal.

My father first introduced me to Linux (an installation disc he borrowed from his employer). It didn't work. It just didn't click for me, and I didn't know why my Dad would consist that I use it.

Fast forward a few years a couple of friends around my age introduced me to Linux; it was Ubuntu back when it was hipster and trendy and friendly. I started by dual booting (probably WUBI) and then switched completely.

This is just purely anecdotal, but my conclusion is that it just didn't work when a parent forces a child to do anything. Better to influence the social circle of the child so that the child can be convinced to learn use Linux from friends.

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