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Plastic might be making us obese

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#321

Post by tsol »

oneoff786 wrote: post #86
bombcar wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's calories in/calories out for the majority - sure there's edge cases where you an discuss more "efficient" bodies, etc, but I daresay our diets are way more caloric than they used to be. And a lot of that is portion size and "added eating" between meals. I'd love to work out just how many calories the various soda companies ship a year.

Eh. I think people drastically underestimate the variance on calories absorbed (the effective amount in) and the calories used for general homeostasis and metabolism (the effective amount out) excluding exercise.

It does indeed have a large effect, the science is clear. Everything from gut bacteria to how often you eat meals can affect the % of caloric intake that gets converted into fat.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#322

Post by tsol »

garren wrote: post #158

> Nearly 1,000 obesogens with such effects have already been identified in studies with animals or humans. They include Bisphenol A, a chemical widely used in plastics, and the phthalates, plasticizing agents used in paints, medicine and cosmetics. Others include parabens used as preservatives in food and paper products, and chemicals called organotins used as fungicides. Other obesogens include pesticides and herbic…

Lack of regulation.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#323

Post by tsol »

sp332 wrote: post #130
davidn20 wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, it's bad in the US, but obesity is rising worldwide. Obesity, in general, correlates with GDP per capital.

Then why are poorer people more obese? Edit: still talking about the USA here.

Go to the dollar store and look at the food there. Everything has sugar in it.(It's also not a great deal due to portion size, but if you don't have much money it's an easy way to get variety). The cheaper the food, the more likely there are cheap sugars meant to made it more palatable

Or look at restaurant/fast food-- the healthier options are the 'premium' options. But if you've got a few buck and want to feed a whole family, a bunch of burgers is still reasonably priced for someone low income

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#324

Post by analog31 »

frankzander wrote: post #77
vallassy wrote: post #52

Is it the plastic though, or is it the sugar? Over my last few years of reading, I've convinced myself that sugar is the main culprit in massive obesity in Western countries, especially the US (i.e. high fructose corn syrup). Sugar is in everything (like plastic, I suppose). Look at the ingredients of what you buy and you'll be surprised where it turns up. Peanut butter, mayonnaise, beef jerky, even bog standard brea…

> Peanut butter, mayonnaise, beef jerky But that's packed with fat calories as well and fat has a much higher energy density as carbohydrates. As an European I'm very very astonished over the size of the food portions in fast food restaurants in the US. If this portion size is the same on the diner table than it's not only sugar but a lot of non necessary calories. I don't think it's entirely caused by sugar but by a…

US restaurant portions are huge. If you eat like that every day, it will kill you. I think one reason is that the ingredients are cheap relative to other costs including labor. It used to be rationalized by saying that a restaurant meal was supposed to be a rare indulgence, but I don't think that's true any more for a large swath of the population.

Anecdote: I had two long meetings at work last week, that crossed over the lunch hour, so they brought in lunch. Each was from a "fast casual" or "fast food" sandwich shop. There was like 1/2 inch slab of processed meat on each sandwich. I would typically put one thin slice of the same meat on a sandwich that I make for the lunch that I bring to work. I discreetly removed most of the meat and threw it away. I know some people who will take a delivered meal like that, cut it in half, and save the second half for the next day.

Another anecdote: There was an article about a town in Texas that was losing its last restaurant, and the author wondered how people would eat.

Of course to maintain a higher body weight, you need to eat more.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#325

Post by chiefalchemist »

novia wrote: post #314
jabroni_salad wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well if you want the One Number That Affects Asians, I think what stands out to me the most is the prevalence of lactose intolerance over there, approaching 90% the more easterly you go. They just do not do very much dairy. Less scientific, but a couple years ago I decided to transition to a more meat-lite diet and ended up turning to Asian cookbooks to make that happen. Veg entrees are just a novelty to western cuis…

You might be onto something. The US government has been subsidizing dairy products [1] and it has caused a huge surplus[2], which processed food manufacturers then try to add into anything they can because it's a cheap filler. But it wouldn't be a cheap filler if it hadn't been for the government propping up the production. Dairy farmers in this country make so much milk that they will sometimes dump it rather than s…

About 20 yrs ago The NYT Sunday mag had an article (read: op-ed-y piece) that proposed the same about corn.

That is, fed subsidies for corn ultimately made high fructose corn syrup dirt cheap. That price point. made it more appealing to add sweetness to more food products. Or made sweet products (e.g., soda) cheaper.

Lower prices...higher consumption... Hello obesity as a cultural norm.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#326

Post by chiefalchemist »

less_less wrote: post #265
Melatonic wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say food - most asian people I know (even ones that eat a pretty western diet) still randomly incorporate a lot of things that are Real Foods or processed type foods that are close to Real Foods. They also eat a lot (generally) more mushrooms and fermented food (and great variety of fermented food - not just yeast based stuff like yogurt). Does it really make sense that Western diets basically just ignore a w…

> They also eat a lot (generally) more mushrooms and fermented food (and great variety of fermented food - not just yeast based stuff like yogurt). Not that this detracts from the rest of your point at all, but yogurt is fermented by bacteria. There are milk drinks that are fermented by SCOBY though, like kefir.

Yogurt might be, but nearly all non-plain yogurt (in US supermarkets) is loaded with sugar. People eating such yogurt believing they're eating "healthy" are making a mistake.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#327

Post by reedjosh »

olddustytrail wrote: post #296
reedjosh wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Checkout this book: https://thebigfatsurprise.com/ Looks like the NHS is behind the times. In the US they've removed statements like the one you linked to. It's becoming scientific consensus that saturated fat doesn't cause heart disease.

I'd rather trust the expertise of doctors who've actually studied this stuff than a moron journalist, thanks.

You're sure fun to chat with.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#328

Post by chiefalchemist »

scoofy wrote: post #304
dorchadas wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm an American in Europe, and really, what I've noticed here is it's natural sugar in stuff, whereas in America it's HFCS. I can't help but wonder if that's part of the difference. I list 5-10kg easily without watching what I ate (and drank much more cause there's nothing else to do of an evening in Ireland), while keeping the same activity level or slightly less. There's something different in the food, and I can't…

This is going to be an extremely challenging thesis to explain the phenomena, as HFCS and sucrose are effectively chemically identical once they hit the stomach.

Yes, but HFCS is cheaper. Cheaper means it ends up in more products. Cheaper means more gets consumed.

I mentioned in another comment above that circa 2003-ish the NYT Sunday mag ran an opinion piece that proposed that gov subsidies of corn were contributing to the obesity crisis. Lower corn prices === lower price for HFCS === more HFCS in more products === more products at lower prices === more sweetener calories being consumed.

Our gut microbes aren't evolved for this type of diet.

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#329

Post by spywaregorilla »

pseudalopex wrote: post #301
spywaregorilla wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're claiming its the primary factor even though it's not obviously higher among the obese populations.

Who said plastic is the primary factor? The Washington Post's expert said determining what fraction of obesity is related to chemical exposure is difficult. The 1st comment said plastic wasn't a factor.

Many people. All over this story and any time something similar comes up

Re: Plastic might be making us obese

#330

Post by mensetmanusman »

evancox100 wrote: post #212
mensetmanusman wrote: post #201

I am very skeptical the effect would be meaningful relative to diet/exercise. We have never been more seditary, and sugar has never been more a part of our diet. When my mother moved in and we started going on daily walks, she lost a pound a week for one year. When she injured her foot and stopped, with no diet change throughout the entire time, she gained it all back in a couple months. I would be surprised if peopl…

The problem with “calories in - calories out = weight gained” is that even though it is of course true (thermodynamics), it explains nothing. If I asked you “Why do children grow bigger?”, and you said “because they eat more calories than they expend”, again you would be correct but have told me nothing. And if a child wasn’t growing like they should, you wouldn’t say “just keep feeding them more”, you would look for…

Everyone overeats and calories have never been cheaper. There is nothing that surprising going on.

The human body was meant for fasting longer than our culture does and in experiencing occasional hunger.

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