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Deno raises $21M

deno.com

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Re: Deno raises $21M

#321

Post by ascorbic »

biztos wrote: post #287
numlock86 wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's interpreters/runtimes for C? At least that's the go-to definition for scripting languages.

I think the point was merely that JavaScript is obviously not the "universal scripting language" and claiming it is demonstrates not just hubris but ignorance. That said, I have tons of little one-off utilities I launch with "go run random-thing.go" because I don't care about the second or two it takes to compile, and if C were my everyday language I'm sure I'd have a compile-and-run wrapper handy. At that point, it'…

Which scripting language has a better claim to being universal? JavaScript runs on billions of diverse systems worldwide, both browser, server and CLI.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#322

Post by lmm »

WA wrote: post #306
lmm wrote: post #297

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The post mentions "The open source Deno runtime shows how clean and productive a modern, batteries-included, programming environment can be" so it sounds like they expect you'll be running database backed apps and not only static sites. It suggests you'll be running a datastore, not necessarily an SQL database (the most overrated technology in existence IMO, especially for web apps where essentially none of its str…

So what’s a good web app datastore in your opinion, if SQL is highly overrated? > Storing old data as-is What does this mean? Can you give an example?

> So what’s a good web app datastore in your opinion, if SQL is highly overrated?

I've used Cassandra very successfully, but there are plenty of options.

> > Storing old data as-is

> What does this mean? Can you give an example?

I mean not migrating the stored version of old data (note I'm not suggesting "no schema" or anything like that; what I'm opposing is the idea that you have a single global mutable version of the schema and mutate historical records in place to match that). E.g. if you started by storing users with a single nationality field and then realised that actually the same user can have multiple nationalities, while you'd change the DTO representation of a user that you read into, you wouldn't rewrite the on-disk representation of previously stored users.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#323

Post by ascorbic »

hayd wrote: post #268
felipeccastro wrote: post #215

I would love to try Deno deploy, but right now there are two deal breakers for me: - why is the CPU time limit so low? 10ms (or even 50ms in Pro version) seems a limit very easy to blow for any sufficiently complex app - why is there no data storage offering available? I'm not sure I see the point of edge deploys while data is still only accessible through a centralized database server. Having a way to deploy a sqlit…

I _believe_ there is an important distinction here between "CPU Time per request" and "Time per request". Most complex apps are going to be IO-bound which shouldn't count towards CPU time. It's strange this isn't more explicit.

Yeah, I found this confusing at first. But you can even run WebSockets on it for minutes at a time, or piped large files through it taking many seconds. As long as they're not using CPU, they can keep running.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#324

Post by LunaSea »

pull_my_finger wrote: post #283
spencerchubb wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Deno is only possible because V8 is so hyper-optimized. If you think about it, V8 has to compile/interpret and then run javascript code on the fly after downloading it in the browser. That's how good V8 is. That puts javascript in a unique position to enable something like Deno So if there was a compiler/interpreter for another language that was close to being as good as V8, then something like this could exist for o…

> if there was a compiler/interpreter for another language that was close to being as good as V8 Like LuaJIT that has been around longer than V8?

LuaJIT is fast however it misses Node.js's (or Python's) standard library and package ecosystem.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#325

Post by tomcam »

ascorbic wrote: post #317
TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #15

> Early in cloud computing, virtual machines were the compute abstraction […] This is funny to me because serverless sounds to me like the return of PHP (etc) shared hosting. What's old is new again?

Anyone who has had to maintain a shared PHP server would say that's very different. I used PHP for years, and now use serverless functions (both Lambda and Deno). Serverless means you don't need to worry about anything except the code. It scales automatically. It never needs updating. It doesn't go down in the middle of the night. It can roll back deploys instantly. Sure, you could pay for managed hosting, and then p…

What’s the SQL story? SQLite, or is PostgreSQL fast enough on startup?

Re: Deno raises $21M

#326

Post by ascorbic »

shiftpgdn wrote: post #225
trentthethief wrote: post #223

Serious question, how do investors plan on making a return on their investment? Where is the cash in this?

There is extreme vendor lockin with services like Deno. I'm sure that it'll be much more expensive in the future.

It's all standards-based code. The WInterCG project makes it even more portable: code should be easy to move between Deno, CLoudflare etc.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#327

Post by ascorbic »

Drblessing wrote: post #305

Is there a NextJS-like framework for Deno?

There's Fresh, but you can run also Next.js on Deno (and Remix and SvelteKit and Astro and Hydrogen and Qwik and 11ty and SolidJS and more). We do it at Netlify. See the examples linked here: https://docs.netlify.com/netlify-labs/experimental-features/...

Re: Deno raises $21M

#328

Post by int_19h »

erikpukinskis wrote: post #294
int_19h wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are many compiled languages that produce more performant code than V8. As you noted yourself yourself, V8 has time constraints - it must be able to compile and run the code "fast enough" for a web page to load. This limits the extent of optimizations that it can perform.

And for the handful of routines where all-out performance is the bottleneck for your business those languages are the right tool for the job. For everything else, there’s JavaScript.

If there was a reason to prefer JS, sure. But it's not really any better in other respects. The only thing it has going for it is that it's forced on you on the frontend.

Re: Deno raises $21M

#329

Post by tomcam »

markandrewj wrote: post #110
ChrisArchitect wrote: post #97

I'm not deep in Node world but I use it and see it being used, who is using Deno out there? Have there been some notable/major ship jumps? Or is it not that kind of situation (perception from when it came on the scene is that's exactly what it is, constantly trying to woo Node devs over). And also there's alot of recognizable brand competition out there from things like Cloudflare, Netlify (but they're an investor in…

I imagine you are already aware, but the creator of Node, Ryan Dahl, is also the creator for Deno. He is trying to create a new language which integrates what he learned from building Node.

New language or new runtime?

Re: Deno raises $21M

#330

Post by ascorbic »

tomcam wrote: post #325
ascorbic wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anyone who has had to maintain a shared PHP server would say that's very different. I used PHP for years, and now use serverless functions (both Lambda and Deno). Serverless means you don't need to worry about anything except the code. It scales automatically. It never needs updating. It doesn't go down in the middle of the night. It can roll back deploys instantly. Sure, you could pay for managed hosting, and then p…

What’s the SQL story? SQLite, or is PostgreSQL fast enough on startup?

You don't run the database itself there, you connect to it remotely. I've not had a chance to try them yet, but PlanetScale Portals look like a great solution there. https://planetscale.com/blog/introducing-planetscale-portals...
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