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Web3? I have my DAOts

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Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#321

Post by virgilp »

digitailor wrote: post #274
Animats wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

2018 was the year the US SEC really cracked down on ICOs. First a few of the totally fraudulent ones.[1] Then, anything that looked like a security offering.[2] The IRS has been gradually upping the pressure. Form 1040 for 2020 included, for the first time on the main form, the question "At any time during 2020, did you sell, receive, send, exchange or otherwise acquire any financial interest in any virtual currency?…

Right, I understand that can appear to be tightening, but the IRS guidance is exactly the same since 2014, as are the penalties. They're now more actively alerting US taxpayers they need to pay taxes on their "virtual currencies." But the US taxpayer has always had that obligation, and the IRS is now starting to more visibly enforce it. They've been doing so less visibly as well. With so much more digital asset econo…

Rules don't matter. Enforced rules do.

If IRS only started tightening their grip in 2020... Their statements prior to 2020 didn't have any effect, yet.

I'm not saying "it's doom and gloom for crypto". I'm saying it's fair to claim things didn't fully play out yet.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#322

Post by AnthonyMouse »

librish wrote: post #319
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember, all this stuff is zero-sum. For every winner, there has to be a loser. That's not how it works. Suppose Bitcoin comes into existence and people mine a billion dollars worth of it. They now have a billion dollars worth of Bitcoin. Nobody else has lost anything. If they sell the Bitcoin and someone else buys it, the buyer hasn't lost anything. They had $100 worth of cash and now they have $100 worth of Bitc…

The point is that for every dollar someone takes out of the crypto eco-system someone else has to put one in. With miners taking their own cut that means the game is actually negative sum for normal people trading in crypto currencies.

For miners it's positive sum. For people who buy cryptocurrency with government-issued currency it's zero sum. They don't show up with cash and go home with nothing. They get that amount of cryptocurrency. They only lose something if the value goes down. Which it might, or it might not.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#323

Post by hanniabu »

_gf4m wrote: post #224
dperfect wrote: post #78

I completely agree with the author. I've been reading a lot about the EVM, and while there's some interesting technology involved, it feels unlikely to be able to support any worthwhile applications outside of blockchain finance or moving $ around the world[0] (since the code can really only directly reference the blockchain itself). It's a bit like playing with a programming language in a sandbox that has (1) has no…

ETH's current scalability problems are beyond terrible, but there are alternatives. You can use chains like Polygon or Avalanche that are EVM, so you get all of the capabilities of Ethereum, but without insane gas fees. There are non-EVM solutions as well like Solana, which has substantially higher throughput while transactions cost a fraction of a cent. Try out other chains than ETH before ruling out web3 imo. There…

> ETH's current scalability problems are beyond terrible, but there are alternatives

The only alternative is ethereum L2s. Avalanche, solana, etc are centralized VC chains that do not have the foundation needed to be the infrastructure of tomorrow.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#324

Post by digitailor »

virgilp wrote: post #321
digitailor wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, I understand that can appear to be tightening, but the IRS guidance is exactly the same since 2014, as are the penalties. They're now more actively alerting US taxpayers they need to pay taxes on their "virtual currencies." But the US taxpayer has always had that obligation, and the IRS is now starting to more visibly enforce it. They've been doing so less visibly as well. With so much more digital asset econo…

Rules don't matter. Enforced rules do. If IRS only started tightening their grip in 2020... Their statements prior to 2020 didn't have any effect, yet. I'm not saying "it's doom and gloom for crypto". I'm saying it's fair to claim things didn't fully play out yet.

That's true, except they have been enforcing and building the capabilities to enforce at a larger scale. They can enforce going back decades, are called in constantly to help other investigations and prosecutions, and are in no rush.

It's just like everything else, literally, and tax evasions only get media coverage under pretty limited circumstances.

Taxation in the space has always had a foregone conclusion that some have chosen to handwave or rationalize away. Not a bright strategy IMO.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#325

Post by hanniabu »

gfodor wrote: post #116
jonny_eh wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you can solve the speed problem by using solana or literally any of the other 100 coins that claim to be fast, or eth2 in six months I've been seeing this claim for years now. It's gotten quite old.

Which claim? The meme that transaction throughput is inherently low in crypto is falsified via solana (as mentioned) or avalanche. Bitcoin will likely always be low TPS. Ethereum 2 maybe will eventually ship.

If you're gonna sacrifice decentralization, security, and uptime then you might as well use a server. No self respecting developer will use solana.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#326

Post by grey-area »

maccolgan wrote: post #302
aaronbrethorst wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’d rather get paid in dollars than in JSON metadata and JPGs of apes.

That's actually what dollars is, JSON metadata.

Backed by a large government with huge resources and control over > 300 million people.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#328

Post by space_rock »

librish wrote: post #319
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember, all this stuff is zero-sum. For every winner, there has to be a loser. That's not how it works. Suppose Bitcoin comes into existence and people mine a billion dollars worth of it. They now have a billion dollars worth of Bitcoin. Nobody else has lost anything. If they sell the Bitcoin and someone else buys it, the buyer hasn't lost anything. They had $100 worth of cash and now they have $100 worth of Bitc…

The point is that for every dollar someone takes out of the crypto eco-system someone else has to put one in. With miners taking their own cut that means the game is actually negative sum for normal people trading in crypto currencies.

Speculation is zero sum ignoring adding liquidity to the market in a positive sum game

Everything else is positive sum. Trading, moving money, storing wealth...

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#329

Post by AnthonyMouse »

KingMachiavelli wrote: post #320
AnthonyMouse wrote: post #312

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Remember, all this stuff is zero-sum. For every winner, there has to be a loser. That's not how it works. Suppose Bitcoin comes into existence and people mine a billion dollars worth of it. They now have a billion dollars worth of Bitcoin. Nobody else has lost anything. If they sell the Bitcoin and someone else buys it, the buyer hasn't lost anything. They had $100 worth of cash and now they have $100 worth of Bitc…

Technically there is a cost per Bitcoin from the power and other costs that occurred from mining. Some might be not fully lost (GPUs, commodity hardware) but the kWh and custom ASICs are just a sunk cost. If Bitcoin goes to $0.01 or even $5, I bet that makes most mined Bitcoins underwater like how pennies and nickels cost more than their face value.

Now you're talking about revenue vs. profit. That part of the "value" is still created, it just goes to the power company or the ASIC manufacturer instead of the miner.

If you mine $100 worth of Bitcoin, there is $100 worth of Bitcoin created, whether the electricity cost you $20 or $120.

Re: Web3? I have my DAOts

#330

Post by ojr »

Animats wrote: post #99

OK. The reason all this happening is that Bitcoin really did go to the moon. That's what powers all this speculation. If the price of Bitcoin had been stable for a decade, and it worked reliably, it would be a useful medium of exchange, but nobody would care. This is all about MAKE MONEY FAST. Bitcoin found some early use cases. Drugs first. Then getting money out of China. Money laundering. Tax evasion. Scams. Bitco…

If ajax was the beginning of Web 2.0, Bitcoin was the beginning of web 3.0 and immutable public databases
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