It's disappointing how many people say "apologies don't work". The purpose of an apology isn't to salvage your reputation, it is to help victims move forward.
What it's like to be cancelled
321–330 of 613 posts
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#322Earlier quoted context omitted.
Good for you for doing the right thing. Let me ask you - did you feel like the hate thrown at you on Twitter was completely organic? Was there anything that made you question the motives of the involved Twits? I ask because the whole smear job vs Stallman felt quite manufactured to me; from the initial Vice article horrifically misquoting him, to the weirdly rabid hate towards anyone defending him on forums like this…
I agree that what Stallman said was misrepresented, and perhaps the later stages of the "cancelling" were more manufactured, but the initial anger that popped up on various MIT mailing lists felt very organic to me. A bit mob-like, definitely driven moreso by emotion than a good-faith reading of what Stallman said, and probably amplified by people who disagreed feeling afraid to speak out. But I wouldn't describe any…
It felt organic but more FAANG centric than, say, broadly OSS centric to me.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#323It seems it's better to stay away entirely from certain sensitive topics. No matter your intentions, no matter what you actually think, it just takes a bit of misunderstanding or bad faith and the whole thing explode.
That is their intention. To shutdown discourse and shift the Overton window. This flows onto preference falsification.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#324What he's supposed to have done: “I was terrible to women. I preyed on them. I ceaselessly hit on them. I pressured them into sex. I got too drunk and did all manner of dumb things.” None of which is illegal. It's not even a matter for civil litigation. He was not accused of doing this as a boss in an organization. Or in a workplace context. There were apparently no criminal charges. No EEOC complaints filed.[1] No a…
The original complaint claimed that he was a groper. That's sexual harassment. It's illegal. It's incredibly toxic and creepy , and people who do it are out of touch cretins who make everything worse. Citing that no one officially lodged a criminal complaint isn't a counterpoint. Most sexual assault isn't pursued. Serial creeps are plying their trade right now. But yeah, if he's associated with a brand and he's going…
> Citing that no one officially lodged a criminal complaint isn't a counterpoint. Most sexual assault isn't pursued. Serial creeps are plying their trade right now.
Actually it is a counterpoint. If someone accuses me of a crime, then refuses to pursue any prosecution of that crime, and then expects me to suffer consequences for that crime, that's a gross injustice.
That's why we have a justice system.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#325It seems it's better to stay away entirely from certain sensitive topics. No matter your intentions, no matter what you actually think, it just takes a bit of misunderstanding or bad faith and the whole thing explode.
No, just post anonymously. Way better. Then your voice is heard, but you don't have to suffer personal consequences.
The opinion of a person with some credibility, like name is N, lives in a city M, occupation is X is valued more than some of anonymous.
Because nowadays there are too many fake accounts, even paid trolls, and talking to them (or even listening to them) is just waste of time, not a meaningful conversation.
My twitter account is anonymous and I sometimes get replies like why would I want to talk to nobody. And they are right, they probably shouldn't.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#326I think without specifically coordinated strategies to fight this, organized by the communities themselves, the cancelers will win and take over these communities because the game theory says they will win every time and pragmatic people are going to defect to the winning team lest be open to attack themselves.
Look how this damaged this community though. All the broken friendships, lost jobs. At the end of the day, the people who didn't come to his defense I think will in many ways be the losers. They are the ones left in the weakened community.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#327Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yeah Twitter is very toxic. I got on a few lists as well. I tried to talk to the NZ civil liberties association about freedom of speech. As it turns out they are against free speech and pro hate speech laws. I didn't know that going in. Then some people put me on a hate speech list. After that I was blocked by a large group of people I'd never encountered. It's a weird place and I'm glad to be off the platform.
I completely believe that whatever happened to you was totally unreasonable, but try to understand that from another person's point of view, the broad "you must be against freedom of speech" thing is "toxic", just as you have experienced "toxic" behavior from the opposite side of the issue.
I'm not saying being against freedom of speech is toxic. I'm saying getting put on a hate speech list for being pro freedom of speech is.
I've had great discussions with friends and family that disagree with me on free speech.
On Twitter people don't seem to treat each other as people, but as representatives of a given ideology.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#328American culture has a really bizarre mix of two things, which you can see playing out here.
1. Oversexualizing everything. Imagery, video, Tinder, clothing styles, everything is in your face sex all the time.
2. Remnants of a Puritan approach to sex. Absolutely nothing is okay unless explicit consent is given repeatedly. Even hugs are considered sexual harassment if not explicitly approved.
I’m not casting judgment and saying X approach to sex is the right one. But this tension is bound to result in events like the one in the link. It mostly just sounds like this guy got drunk and hit on girls with a little too much fervor. Not a great thing, but probably not something one should obsess over years later.
Everyone needs to lighten up, frankly.
Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#329I recently gave a test lecture about a topic in statistics, where I showed a meme that a statistics professor I follow shared on her Twitter feed [1]. I thought it would be safe to include as it didn't get any negative reactions on Twitter and was already being used by a professor in her university class in the US. After the talk I immediately got called out by the women's representative on the hiring commission, who…
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Re: What it's like to be cancelled
#330American culture has a really bizarre mix of two things, which you can see playing out here. 1. Oversexualizing everything. Imagery, video, Tinder, clothing styles, everything is in your face sex all the time. 2. Remnants of a Puritan approach to sex. Absolutely nothing is okay unless explicit consent is given repeatedly. Even hugs are considered sexual harassment if not explicitly approved. I’m not casting judgment…
Social and commercial sanctions for people who "pressure" women into sex at industry events isn't "puritanism".