Who Americans spend their time with, by age

- First of all, in absolute numbers it shows that a lot of older people in developed countries are lonely. It may not be a majority of people but that's kinda like saying 'don't worry, covid has a mortality rate of just 1%'.

- Then the article tries to show that people in these countries self-report that they have social support--that they have someone who can help them if they get in trouble--but it fails to show the breakdown of those who have social support by age, which is kind of the critical question here: do older people have social support?

- Then, the article tries to show that there's not much correlation between being alone and being lonely--but it again fails to show whether this is true for older people specifically, or just for the aggregate sample.

- Then it talks about 'aggregate' statistics again, instead of focusing on older people.

There seems to be quite a lot of bending over backwards trying to convince us that older people are not lonely, but no cogent argument.

[1] https://ourworldindata.org/lonely-not-alone

OP was talking about Vietnam, my experience is in rural Italy and matches the idea of people helping each other, not of the exploitation of the women.

And not in an idealised way either, I could make countless examples that I experienced first hand, growing up with 18 cousins and spending together every easter, Christmas and summer holiday for large part of our lives. Especially summer holidays that last three months in Italy.

They are my sisters and brothers, even though I only have one "real" sister, my 8 aunts are my moms, my 8 uncles are my dads, when I was a kid I probably spent more time with them than with my parents that were working 12 hour shifts in hospital (they did the exact same job and shared 50/50 parenting) and sent me and my sister to our grandparents when schools were closed, so we didn't have to be alone at home or with a baby sitter.

I feel lucky to have a family where no one is left behind or alone.

I never felt we were dependent, on the contrary, they let me develop my independence and I have been a kid who spent long moments alone and still do as an adult.

What you call pastoral I call it sense of community.

Yes, women had it bad in the past, but what you're seeing is not reduced dependence, it's solitude.

Maybe the fact that I grew up in a socialist family makes my perspective different, but I can't imagine old people wanting to be alone, away from their family and loved ones, unless they are forced to.

And the worst thing is that even if you were right and old people are simply fulfilling their desire of independence, women have it worse all the same: stats say that in USA 75% of the elderly living alone are women and to make things even worse widowers have more chances of remarriage than widows.

Considering that old people living alone have more chances of falling into poverty, that poverty increases the chances of being alone even more, that eating it's a social activity for many people, so living alone increases the risk of malnutrition and that in the presence of health issues loneliness increases the chances of the symptoms getting worse, I wouldn't consider more time alone a blessing, not for men nor for women.

It was sort of like parents talking about children, except here the children could read, had been parents and were wiser.

No one proposing to ask the elders what they might want or need. People pushing political and social agendas tangential to the core issue (surprise, surprise). Sweeping generalizations with no supporting information or, at best, anecdatum (always one datum). Par for the online course, but easier to see when you are the target demographic.

Old people, like old trees, become more gnarled and unique as time progresses. Some might say more interesting, some say less useful..check out Taoism for more insight there. Young people are more similar and they look to many others for stimulation because they themselves are...pretty boring. Old people are much more interesting in their own right, and each of their old friends pack ten times the interestingness of a stripling, so far fewer are needed. An old friend or acquaintance brings an order of magnitude or more adult experiences, a multidimensional nature, and the metadata of all the times and places in which they were lived. A young person (From a heart standpoint, the older a person gets, the more transpersonal their emotions and energies, in preparation for their next journey. The truly aged are the dawning of the Age of Aquarius, but they aren’t around long enough for the young to realize it. Conditioned love is there, but is “emptying into white”. Best not to muck around too much if you are young, even if you are a family member.