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How to Write in Plain English

plainenglish.co.uk

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Re: How to Write in Plain English

#321
post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree with > Starting a paragraph with However doesn't seem right. If I were to do this, my paragraphs would become at least 3 times as long. Because much of my writing is complex enough that it takes about half a page to make the 'basic argument' and another half a page to explain the exceptions to the basic argument. I would put both half-pages in separate paragraphs. And I do think it makes sense to start the…

> If I were to do this, my paragraphs would become at least 3 times as long. Because much of my writing I find this jarring to read. That should be a comma, not a period. By using a period, you've technically made your sentence shorter, but the structure is unchanged. Alternatively you could just chop the Because , and it would flow fine. I really doubt your writing is thrice the density of mine. I very rarely encoun…

> Alternatively you could just chop the Because, and it would flow fine.

Hmmm, I guess I agree. I am going to try that a lot. In sentence structure I often get the issue of "$Claim, because $justification." This leads to really long sentences that I feel should be split. And again, I want to preserve the link between the two parts. Doing $Claim. $Justification. Feels like I am making an unsubstantiated claim followed by another unrelated claim.

In the programming language I would see this sort of as:

    int a = foo(b);

    int foo(b){
        return 1 + b
    }
(Ignoring a forward declaration of foo in some header).

I guess this is similar to my earlier point. Where I want to split the un-related parts but still want to capture the strong relation between the two.

An alternative might be something like.

"We know that $justification. Hence, it follows that $claim."

You've given me food for thought. Thanks!

Re: How to Write in Plain English

#322
post #279

I don't write in E-Prime, but I think it raises a valid point: you can often clarify and strengthen your English sentences by avoiding the verb "to be". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E-Prime

Given someone called John who is a racist, can you find a way to say "John is a racist" in E-Prime without making John seem less racist?

I think that's kind of the point of using e-prime.

We are forced to identify explain specific evidence of behavior that John has done that show that he's a racist.

Saying that, "John in frequently unkind to people different from him" or "John commonly uses racial slurs" goes beyond applying a label. This kind of approach to describing the ways people's actions hurt others requires more work. The pay off is that this kind of claim is also harder to credibly dismiss as "grievance culture."

Mind you even when trying to stay close to E-prime I still miss the mark all the time.

Re: How to Write in Plain English

#323
post #85
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't make your readers hold parts of the sentence in their head. Reorder or split sentences until it can be avoided. In other words, use a really small buffer. "You must fill form 331 unless you are over 60 years old, in which case you must fill form 445." "You must fill form 331. If you are over 60 years old, you must fill 445 instead." "If you are over 60 years old, you must fill form 445. Otherwise, you must fill…

> Don't make your readers hold parts of the sentence in their head. Funny to read this as I'm learning German! In German the main verb of a sentence has to be at the end depending on the context (e.g: if it is a question, or following some prepositions such as "dass"). Let's say we want to build a question, it will be constructed this way: 1. question marker (such as "Was", "Wo", "Warum", etc) 2. subject 3. other det…

As someone who is also learning German (Viel Glück!), doesn't the verb always go into the second position unless:

1. It's an infinitive verb, perfect verb, or a verb in a subclause, in which case it goes to the end.

2. You're asking a question without a question word (i.e. "Can you" or "Will you") or issuing a command, in which case the verb moves to the beginning).

Examples:

Verb in second position:

> "Was willst du" -> What do you want?

Infinitive verb at the end of the clause:

> "Ich will mit dir reden" -> I want to talk to you

Conjugated verb at the end of a subclause:

> "Kannst du mir versprechen, dass du mich nie verlassen -wirst?" -> Can you promise you will never leave me

Just to clarify, I'm not any sort of authority on this. Merely trying to double check my own understanding as I continue on my language learning journey :)

Re: How to Write in Plain English

#324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, English too has some interesting ideas where to put prepositions in the sentence, that is, turn them basically into postpositions. For example, "Which basket did you put that exquisite marble figurine in?" The "in" is logically related to "which basket", so one would expect that the question would actually be *"In which basket...", but nope, that's rustic and colloquial at best. I suspect it's because of the wo…

This is the type of errant sentence up with which I will not put.

with that I'd put myself up with, but nice would be if more was written text along the lines of this...

Re: How to Write in Plain English

#325
post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't make your readers hold parts of the sentence in their head. Funny to read this as I'm learning German! In German the main verb of a sentence has to be at the end depending on the context (e.g: if it is a question, or following some prepositions such as "dass"). Let's say we want to build a question, it will be constructed this way: 1. question marker (such as "Was", "Wo", "Warum", etc) 2. subject 3. other det…

As someone who is also learning German (Viel Glück!), doesn't the verb always go into the second position unless: 1. It's an infinitive verb, perfect verb, or a verb in a subclause, in which case it goes to the end. 2. You're asking a question without a question word (i.e. "Can you" or "Will you") or issuing a command, in which case the verb moves to the beginning). Examples: Verb in second position: > "Was willst du…

Pretty much! However, as such it's really only second in simple present and preterite statements, which are actually sort of rare outside of really simple sentences.

In light of that, the default German construction is effectively verb-last. (separable prefixes moving to the end exacerbates this need for buffering too)

Re: How to Write in Plain English

#326
post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who is also learning German (Viel Glück!), doesn't the verb always go into the second position unless: 1. It's an infinitive verb, perfect verb, or a verb in a subclause, in which case it goes to the end. 2. You're asking a question without a question word (i.e. "Can you" or "Will you") or issuing a command, in which case the verb moves to the beginning). Examples: Verb in second position: > "Was willst du…

Pretty much! However, as such it's really only second in simple present and preterite statements, which are actually sort of rare outside of really simple sentences. In light of that, the default German construction is effectively verb-last. (separable prefixes moving to the end exacerbates this need for buffering too)

Good point! The separable verb things is super strange for me as a native English speaker. I haven't internalized the meaning for any separable verbs so whenever I see them in text, I usually end up having to re-read or re-listen to the text with the knowledge in mind to actually get the meaning.

Üben macht den Meister!

Re: How to Write in Plain English

#327

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Spanish spellings are quite standardized around the world, the “language academies” of each country collaborate together. Moreover Spanish writing is phonetic so there’s only really one way to pronounce a written word. On the other hand, in Spain we’re famous for “cecear”, that is to pronounce “c” as the z in zombie; while in the rest of Latin America the pronounce it more like an s.

> Spanish writing is phonetic so there’s only really one way to pronounce a written word. So there are no accents or dialects in Spain?

Of course there are. What I mean is that each letter is only pronounced one way.

For example, in English the "o" in "woman" and "women" sounds different, with exactly the same syllabic structure. However in Spanish, every time you write the "o" it is pronounced the same as every other "o". In some accents/dialects some letters will have slightly different pronunciations or intonations (e.g. c turns into s, or s at the end of a word will turn silent), but within that accent, most sounds will remain stably linked to a letter.

EDIT: Of course, I am not a linguist and I'm sure every word of my example can be debunked a million ways; but this is the experience of the language for a native Spain Spanish speaker.

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