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Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

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Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#321

Post by calafrax »

Animats wrote: post #263
dpiers wrote: post #252

Can we stop describing ICO raises in USD? They raised ethereum tokens (ETH). The value of those tokens is specious, as there is no liquidity for the volume of ETH raised. Based on current ETH/USD rates, the USD figure given translates to ~614K ETH. The value of 614K ETH has ranged from 92MM USD to 240MM USD in the last two months, and has been as low as 4.3MM USD since the beginning of the year.

I really want to hear the story when someone dumps $100M worth of Etherium. Or Bitcoin. I wonder what would happen if you went to an Bitcoin exchange and said "I want to sell $100M worth of Bitcoins over the next 30 days. I'll pay your usual fees. After each day's sales, you wire transfer the proceeds to my bank within one business day, and you agree to a sizable penalty if you're late. Any validation of identity you…

The price crashes to 0.10 cents ... https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-30/the-45-mi... ... and that was only 12.5 million. and then coinbase paid people who lost money out of their own capital. lol. ponzi at its finest.

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#322

Post by redm »

dpiers wrote: post #252

Can we stop describing ICO raises in USD? They raised ethereum tokens (ETH). The value of those tokens is specious, as there is no liquidity for the volume of ETH raised. Based on current ETH/USD rates, the USD figure given translates to ~614K ETH. The value of 614K ETH has ranged from 92MM USD to 240MM USD in the last two months, and has been as low as 4.3MM USD since the beginning of the year.

"The value of 614K ETH has ranged from 92MM USD to 240MM USD in the last two months,"

As I see it that's irrelevant. Whats relevant is the value at the time of the investment. As of yesterday, they raised Ethereum that had a then value of $186m. The fact that it may go up or down tomorrow is irrelevant.

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#323

Post by coderzach »

genon wrote: post #304
darkerside wrote: post #270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire Internet

I don't know if this just sounded like a zinger to you when you wrote it, but "the Internet" is a prime example of anything but a solution in search of a problem.

What big problem did the early internet solve? Sending messages between universities? Why not just use a phone?

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#324

Post by jonreem »

qaq wrote: post #320
mrb wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" no liquidity for the volume of ETH raised " Look again. Poloniex alone exchanges $1 billion dollars, 3M ETH, on the ETH/BTC pair, weekly. https://cryptowat.ch/poloniex/ethbtc/1w Volume on the path ETH→BTC→USD is a lot higher than ETH→USD and that's the path that whales dumping ETH take.

"Volume on the path ETH→BTC→USD is a lot higher than ETH→USD" which kinda reinforces the point that there is no liquidity

If you can get USD at the end why does it matter if you have to go through BTC for now? The liquidity is still there.

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#325

Post by mbesto »

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #244
mbesto wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, maybe I didn't get your original point - I thought you were insinuating that ICO was a technology in search a problem and that all super successful (i.e. good) technologies starts this way (which I would disagree).

I thought you were insinuating that ICO was a technology in search a problem and that all super successful technologies starts this way. Not insinuating, that's my claim - nearly every big technology was too early (eg. a solution looking for a problem - whether in form or scale) before it blew up years or decades later. I don't think that's controversial. It's also true that a lot of trash that never makes it are als…

I think you're confusing their adoption curve with a problem they solve. For example - PDA's certainly solved a problem (having a mobile/digital calendar), they just didn't solve enough problems when they were introduced.

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#326

Post by drieddust »

matthewbauer wrote: post #297
drieddust wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not deny the utility of crypocurrencies there will be winners out of this. But current breed of investors will trigger another bout of golbal meltdown. Even Amazon lost its value during the crash so chances are that most investors sold out everything in panic. Only those who had nerves of iron actually came out alive.

I don't think there's enough money in cryptocurrencies to trigger a global meltdown. It will no doubt have an effect of the economy, but it's still fringe enough that a crash in the near future would be mostly harmless.

At the moment it's not but of this mania continued for some more time it will snowball as more and more folks get in just because they don't want to miss out.

I hope you are right and crash comes early on.

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#327

Post by pessimizer »

adventured wrote: post #129
empath75 wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am starting to worry that this bubble is going to grow until it threatens the world economy.

An extremely small fraction of the inflated value of these coins is actually part of - interacting with - the global economy. Most of it is not and will never be liquid. Most of it has been and is locked up, not touching other aspects of the global economy, and most of the actual bubble value will vaporize without ever touching any part of the 'real' global economy. It's the specific reason there is nothing to fear a…

> Most of it has been and is locked up, not touching other aspects of the global economy, and most of the actual bubble value will vaporize without ever touching any part of the 'real' global economy.

I think the question is how much actual currency will be borrowed against cryptocoin valuations, and how much and over how many generations will people manage to leverage that credit, before that value vaporizes. Derivatives will always be the problem. With the actual economy not producing returns (over 1 or 2%), cryptocurrency may distribute the paper value that investors demand throughout the economy without 99% of people and funds being able to find a mention of any cryptocurrency in their own portfolios.

What is the state of cryptocoin derivatives anyway? Are they being synthetically collateralized? Are they part of any major consumer fund mix?

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#328

Post by pessimizer »

tome wrote: post #203
drieddust wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>An extremely small fraction of the inflated value of these coins is actually part of - interacting with - the global economy. Most of it is not and will never be liquid. I am not sure how you arrived at this conclusion? As more money will move into these currencies, won't it create an impact when eventual crash arrives. > The dotcom bubble implosion wiped out trillions in moderately liquid value (the US stock market…

Money doesn't "move into these currencies". Someone has USD, someone has BTC. They swap. That's it.

You're not saying anything that couldn't be said about houses in the US Midwest.

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#329

Post by loceng »

RexetBlell wrote: post #260
loceng wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you make the claim that that $186M is liquid? Last time someone dumped a large amount - $1-2M worth of Etheruem's Ether? - it tanked.

In the past 30 days, over 30 Billion dollars worth of Ether has been purchased. 2 million is nothing. Source: https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/volume/monthly/

Here, I'll pay buy $1 million worth from you, if you'll buy $1 million worth next week. Sound good?

Likewise, that "$30B USD" is referencing exchange between different crypto-assets, yes?

Re: Filecoin Suspends ICO After Raising $186M in One Hour

#330

Post by loceng »

ojr wrote: post #219
loceng wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How can you make the claim that that $186M is liquid? Last time someone dumped a large amount - $1-2M worth of Etheruem's Ether? - it tanked.

it was a flash crash as in it ended in a flash/quickly and the price rebounded, central banks becoming insolvent and not being liquid and needing bailouts are the reason there is high speculation in crypto tokens in the first place, the trust is shifted from the bankers to the developers

That's a neat distraction from how crypto-assets will ultimately shift a lot (an unreasonable amount) of wealth to early adopters simply because they were early adopters, if it gains a legitimate status as a currency throughout nations.
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