What I Heard from Trump Supporters • Hacker News Board

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#321

Post by mildbow » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

tonyedgecombe wrote: post #94

dboreham wrote: post #21

Honestly not sure this sheds much light. Doesn't it boil down to: I always vote Republican regardless, sorry. I vote according to my pet wedge issue (usually guns or abortion), sorry. I'm bigoted and racist but I'm not going to admit to that. The alternative candidate wasn't very appealing so I figured why not? I liked the idea of a bomb-thrower, sorry.

"I always vote Republican regardless, sorry." I wonder if there's more of that than we realise, the Republican vote has been pretty consistent in recent elections.

I agree. iirc, turnouts were average for Republicans, but the Democrats lost the election by not voting.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#322

Post by smallgovt » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

I think it's worth noting that this article and thread has created a space where inclusion and pacifism are being over-valued (and a lot of pitying and white-knight behavior is supported).

There's nothing intrinsically wrong with being divisive around an ISSUE. Clearly defining sides is constructive in creating a productive debate.

The problem is when judgement and divisiveness expands beyond ISSUES to PEOPLE.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#323

Post by dguaraglia » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

cylinder wrote: post #160

Yhippa wrote: post #40

This one gave me the most pause: > “Silicon Valley is incredibly unwelcoming to alternative points of view. Your curiosity, if it is sincere, is the very rare exception to the rule.” Substitute "Silicon Valley" for any major liberal enclaves, like universities and cities, and I think you see the same thing. I am skeptical by nature and try to take a scientific view of new ideas. However I feel like I get shouted down…

Same thing, even with long-time friends, if I am trying to counter their hysteria (they're reading and sharing "fake news," too, and I just want to point out the inaccuracy of their statements or test them with logic, I'm called an "alt-right fascist." Honestly, the level of discourse in this country is an absolute joke. It doesn't matter what side you are on.

The fact that you are using the term "hysteria" tells me that you've been reading your own brand of fake news ("get it? They are hysterical, like women on their period! harharhar!").

Maybe if you are intellectually honest and discuss topics instead of talking points, you might get a different response. I've had some pleasant discussions with Trump supporters when we actually talked about real problems (not imagined terrorizing hordes, which is a manifestation of the right's own 'hysteria') and Trump's proposed solutions would or would not fix them. The ones that come straight away with "THE MEDIA IS MAKING EVERYTHING UP!!!"... not so much.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#324

Post by lowpro » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

wwweston wrote: post #152

Exofunctor wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did not vote for Trump, but I couldn't help but feel a bit of schadenfreude at the reaction of my mostly very liberal friend group to his win. For months and months, they'd been unfairly denigrating Trump supporters while simultaneously insisting that he was a joke, there was no way he would beat Clinton, etc. and somehow convincing themselves that their political ideology was synonymous with science, truth, and re…

> unfairly denigrating Trump supporters Is there a way of fairly denigrating Trump supporters? > For months and months, they'd been unfairly denigrating Trump supporters while simultaneously insisting that he was a joke, there was no way he would beat Clinton, etc. and somehow convincing themselves that their political ideology was synonymous with science, truth, and reason. There may be liberal voters who make that…

> Is there a fair way of denigrating Trump supporters?

Yes, by realizing that he won because of his economics, not his social positions. The rust belt votes of economic issues, which allowed him to win. The poor in the area lean to whoever will help them not be poor, or at least say they'll try. Clinton embodied the status quo, Trump was change. They might not have liked him, and in fact a sizable majority do not, but realizing it was a pick of the lesser of two equals hopefully restores some sympathy for the other side, which is sorely needed today.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#325

Post by CptMauli » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

What stood out to me was actually the first comment:

> He says true but unpopular things. If you can’t talk about > problems, you can’t fix them.

My take on Trump would rather be, that he says false but poular things (popular in the literal sense, not necessarily what is popular in the media).

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#326

Post by YCode » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

It's fascinating to me how many of the likes listed are feelings-based arguments and how many of the nervous/dislikes are more based on specific events and evidence.

Granted, as noted they are narratives so it's hard to say if that's some kind of bias in how it's put together or even my own bias in reading it.

Even still, it struck me as interesting how much more cold and logical the dislikes/nervous items were in their appraisal of a presidential candidate.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#327

Post by dahart » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

tylerwhipple wrote: post #199

austenallred wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I moved to San Francisco from a rural town, and I would feel 10x more comfortable sharing my liberal viewpoints in a small, deeply-red town than I would insinuating something anything less than 100% left-leaning at work here. People disagree in small town Utah, and it would be uncomfortable. In San Francisco you're ostracized. It even makes me nervous to leave my name attached to a comment like this, knowing that my…

I went from Salt Lake City to San Francisco as well. I have always been quite liberal on issues and it had never been a problem, but when discussing issues in SF I felt I had to be very careful with what I supported. I always felt my friendships/employment was threatened if I disagreed. I had a good friend/startup founder once say anyone who supported Trump deserved to be fired and blacklisted.

Ha! I'm also a Salt Lake native transplant to San Fran. In Utah, I am a socialist pinko commie. In San Francisco I'm (apparently) somewhere between a libertarian and a tea party republican.

At least, that's my story. I'm exaggerating for effect, and in the spirit of fun. But I was literally publicly berated at work once on the company forum for not being liberal enough, not having views consistent with California democrats, and not contributing enough money to the party.

I never feared for my job though, that's awful. I could have actually been a conservative and I wouldn't have had to worry. There were conservatives in the company, though they did keep rather quiet about their views.

Someone who makes a blanket statement about firing anyone with impure thoughts... it happens, but let's hope it was only a moment of weakness or anger on your friend's part.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#328

Post by SnowFace » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:32 PM UTC

st3v3r wrote: post #195

"For months and months, they'd been unfairly denigrating Trump supporters" If you support a candidate who espouses racist, sexist, xenophobic, and general bigoted views, a candidate who was caught on tape as bragging about sexual assault, then it is not unfair to paint you as supporting those things. To me, anyone who supports Trump has declared their support for those things. And it is on them to prove that they are…

Show me where Trump is racist. Show me just one example.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#329

Post by sedachv » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:33 PM UTC

str33t_punk wrote: post #257

sedachv wrote: post #129

What a great example of white male privilege. "My access to toys like shotguns is more important than your rights to abortion/basic human rights as a trans person/..."

What a useless and unhelpful comment? This whole article was about figuring out why people voted for Trump so it doesn't happen again. Moral of the story was that comments like your's have drove a lot towards Trump. Some one makes a comment about why they support Trump, contributing to the article, and you immediately jump to an -ism that will probably push them farther towards that side. Do you not realize that you…

How is it useless and unhelpful? I am pointing out that people voted for Trump because they lack basic empathy and understanding towards other people's real problems. I like recreational shooting and was an NRA member for two years, enough to develop a serious dislike of 2nd amendment obsessives. Prioritizing your hobby over women's rights is disgusting.

Re: What I Heard from Trump Supporters

#330

Post by azrazalea » Tue, Feb 21, 2017, 7:33 PM UTC

Dirlewanger wrote: post #268

rosser wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think there was any doubt in anyone's mind about what Milo was going to say.

Yeah, he's vain, and above all else he is about building his personal brand, and with that come the incredibly inflammatory "feminism is cancer" sound bytes, but if you ever actually watched some of the talks he's been doing on his tour, he brings up a lot of valid grievances with today's society and culture. If you won't do minimal research on the opposition, and instead think violence is the answer, then you're alr…

I agree that violence isn't the answer.

However, my main beef with Milo (and why I would support peaceful protesting about his talks) is his specific and public harassment of specific people. This is the main example https://broadly.vice.com/en_us/article/trans-student-harasse....

I'm personally very pro free speech(not just from a government censorship standpoint, but as a general principle) and therefore am fine with him saying horrible things about groups of people and still being invited.

I am not fine with personal attacks/harassment.