Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

My Next Mac Mini

rustyshelf.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

321–330 of 361 posts

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#321

Post by jdietrich »

beautifulfreak wrote: post #316
nextos wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. Is the Mac Mini so special it can't be updated by a small team periodically? Nope. It is in fact a quite mainstream machine, nothing too special about it. The uniqueness in the Mac Mini lies in Mac OS. No laser sharp focus is needed for incremental hardware updates. The Mac Pro has unique hardware, but between major redesigns it does not need any incredibly hard work. Just incremental improvements. I find it…

"It is in fact a quite mainstream machine, nothing too special about it." The mini introduced a form factor that has since been emulated so often that it seems less special than it was at first, but it was something new. Small computers extant back then were larger than the mini. Most were based on the Mini ITX motherboard design, introduced in 2001, and all of them looked like boxen (ugly). The mini's dimensions gav…

The Mac Mini was special over a decade ago. It's now just commodity hardware in an aluminium unibody. There are a multitude of competing machines from Intel, Gigabyte, Asus, Zotac and others. There is absolutely no reason why Apple couldn't redesign the Mac Mini chassis to take an industry-standard NUC motherboard and offer a refresh every 12 months.

I won't buy Apple hardware any more because I don't want to be locked into their ecosystem. I don't want to be subject to the whims of a "tastemaker" who decides that I don't need PCIe or USB or a headphone jack. I don't trust Apple not to neglect a key platform for years.

Apple can afford to lose me, because iPhone sales are equivalent to the GDP of some countries. If at some point that golden goose starts looking unhealthy, they might regret pissing off their most loyal customers. They might suddenly realise that the creative professionals who were a cornerstone of their brand have abandoned them.

As of today, the Mac Pro has gone 1137 days without an update. Three years is an eternity for a music producer or a video editor to go without fresh hardware. The introduction of 4K video has only exacerbated the issue, as has the fiasco of FCPX.

A lot of people feel deeply betrayed by Apple. People who would happily give Apple $10,000 every couple of years for a fully loaded Mac Pro. People who have bought every Apple desktop since the Macintosh. People who are role models in their fields. People whose choices define the term "industry standard". Can Apple afford to alienate those people?

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#322

Post by hendersoon »

intrasight wrote: post #162
fowlerpower wrote: post #157

Someone here needs to explain it to me because I just don't understand. We have the largest computer company in the world, a shit load of people work there, supposedly smart people. Yet they can't put together a refresh of many of their desktop machines. Why the fuck not? What do all those people getting paid all that money do all day? I can only imagine the conversations, "it takes years it has to be super innovativ…

I think what you're missing is that Apple pursues high-margin endeavors, and competing with a $300 NUC isn't going to be a high-margin business. Some easy money for Apple would be to sell OS licenses for Intel NUCs.

The NUC in question, the NUC7i5BNK, is $620. That is without RAM or storage, so add another $50 for 8GB RAM, $80 for a 128GB M.2 SSD, and $100 for a Windows license. Total price is $850. This guy isn't cheaping out, he just wants more hardware for his money.

$700 at Apple gets you a much slower 3 generation old i5 with a 1TB hard drive. But, with MacOS.

It's one thing for Apple to charge a premium for better hardware. But that is NOT what they're doing. They're charging the same amount for ancient, inferior hardware.

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#323

Post by sliken »

hendersoon wrote: post #322
intrasight wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think what you're missing is that Apple pursues high-margin endeavors, and competing with a $300 NUC isn't going to be a high-margin business. Some easy money for Apple would be to sell OS licenses for Intel NUCs.

The NUC in question, the NUC7i5BNK, is $620. That is without RAM or storage, so add another $50 for 8GB RAM, $80 for a 128GB M.2 SSD, and $100 for a Windows license. Total price is $850. This guy isn't cheaping out, he just wants more hardware for his money. $700 at Apple gets you a much slower 3 generation old i5 with a 1TB hard drive. But, with MacOS. It's one thing for Apple to charge a premium for better hardware…

Never pay MSRP, the NUC7i7BNK is going for $500 ish on preorder. The NUC7i5BNK is going for $400. The i3 version for $300, and the celeron or whatever is below the i3 is going for $200 ish.

However the nuc generation7 i5 is the lowest model with the iris graphics.

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#324

Post by brandon272 »

remir wrote: post #258
rsync wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It's bizarre to see a company with the wealth and resources of Apple not even putting out spec upgrades for their machines." What's so bizarre is that the things that people want are actually the easiest and cheapest things for apple to do. All anyone wants is a macbook air with a retina screen. Not a new 12" one, not a new form factor, not design and engineer some new razor thin design ... just take the same old ca…

What Apple lacks is humility. Jobs even said people don't know what they want until "you showed it to them". So, I highly doubt that Apple will listen to what people want. I mean, Apple would make a killing with a new Mac Mini with better spec, a Macbook Air with better screen res, couple of USB-C ports, a 24" iMac instead of 21, etc... But Apple won't do it because that would be listening to people, and this is some…

It's interesting... unless my memory is failing me, you never hear Apple say anything to the effect of, "We listened to our customers, so we decided to _____"

I mean, I agree with what Jobs said when he suggested that customers expect Apple to innovate and curate and make it's own decisions about what products it develops. But I think you can also take that too far, especially when your customers are screaming at you on certain topics.

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#325

Post by dustinmr »

jdietrich wrote: post #321
beautifulfreak wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It is in fact a quite mainstream machine, nothing too special about it." The mini introduced a form factor that has since been emulated so often that it seems less special than it was at first, but it was something new. Small computers extant back then were larger than the mini. Most were based on the Mini ITX motherboard design, introduced in 2001, and all of them looked like boxen (ugly). The mini's dimensions gav…

The Mac Mini was special over a decade ago. It's now just commodity hardware in an aluminium unibody. There are a multitude of competing machines from Intel, Gigabyte, Asus, Zotac and others. There is absolutely no reason why Apple couldn't redesign the Mac Mini chassis to take an industry-standard NUC motherboard and offer a refresh every 12 months. I won't buy Apple hardware any more because I don't want to be lock…

This, which was posted a short time ago, seems relevant to this comment.

http://www.economist.com/news/business-and-finance/21711011-...

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#326

Post by nextos »

dustinmr wrote: post #325
jdietrich wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Mac Mini was special over a decade ago. It's now just commodity hardware in an aluminium unibody. There are a multitude of competing machines from Intel, Gigabyte, Asus, Zotac and others. There is absolutely no reason why Apple couldn't redesign the Mac Mini chassis to take an industry-standard NUC motherboard and offer a refresh every 12 months. I won't buy Apple hardware any more because I don't want to be lock…

This, which was posted a short time ago, seems relevant to this comment. http://www.economist.com/news/business-and-finance/21711011-...

Neither Apple nor Google seem to be applying many of the principles outlined in that article.

To me this is just a sign of broken management. Apple has a minimal product line. Not being able to refresh products regularly is unacceptable. Furthermore, they don't have a complete ecosystem anymore which has an impact on the whole experience.

Google is also broken, but in a different way. They are stuck in a perpetual cycle of release-abandon products, with some insane duplicities. For example, Hangouts/Allo/Duo.

Google has discontinued the much praised Google Reader, plus replaced open Google Talk by closed Hangouts. Also released Allo & Duo, confusing everyone. A royal mess.

Apple is unwilling to update Mac Pro & Mini frequently. They have also discontinued their screens (and third party USB C ones are not working well) and also discontinued all their routers.

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#327

Post by caleblloyd »

mattnewton wrote: post #261
tim333 wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see what you are saying but you'd think you could update some of the chips in the mini without needing much company attention?

Apple doesn't just update chips and throw it over the wall. It is, for better or for worse, always a large scale qa, supply chain and engineering effort.

They did with the MacBook Air for years. 1440x900 TN panel over 6 refreshes from 2010-2015 and still on sale today.

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#328

Post by aorth »

Actually that machine looks great—but where do I buy one? I searched for the product number of that NUC on Amazon and only find different (older) versions? There's something to be said for Apple's naming scheme versus "NUC Kit NUC7i5BNK" !

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#329

Post by rasengan0 »

I'm in the same boat but opted for ChromeOS with Linux https://github.com/dnschneid/crouton on https://www.groupon.com/deals/gg-acer-116-chromebook-2857 My current mac mini sits idle only used for activities Chrome / linux doesn't support

Oh yeah, Apple? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13511241

Re: My Next Mac Mini

#330

Post by bootload »

mattnewton wrote: post #294
bootload wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I believe it has to do with a culture of "laser focus" " The problem with this ^focused^ (linear) thinking is the real value of apple in the past has been from ^diffuse^ (intuitive, unconscious wondering connections, slightly riskier) thinking. I know this is simplistic but the successful apple will be using both modes.

I don't think that was meant by laser focus. I think it meant to really hone in on a few things that will have large impact, at the expense of linear improvements. Apple is in love with the big, sexy revolutionary unveiling and that thrill and opportunity is what they are laser focused on. If it doesn't get them to that point, they say No to it. That thing might require linear or divergent thinking to make work. But…

"Apple is in love with the big, sexy revolutionary unveiling and that thrill and opportunity is what they are laser focused on."

Fair point. Direction at apple doesn't have Jobs for aesthetics. apple has long forgotten the brilliance of Woz and open access to hardware. We'll see how this plays out (as I type out on mbp kb).

Post reply on HN