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U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

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Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#311

Post by [deleted] »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #188
GHFigs wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are going straight into "think of the children mode" ... apparently "what about the terrorists?" isn't as effective anymore. "They" in this case is the chief of a metro police department, whose forensic and surveillance resources are more often spent on pedophiles and drug dealers than terrorism. What else would they say? If the article's authors wanted a "what about the terrorists?" quote they would have gone t…

> "They" in this case is the chief of a metro police department, whose forensic and surveillance resources are more often spent on pedophiles and drug dealers than terrorism. What else would they say? You're saying "pedophiles and drug dealers" as if it wasn't 99% drug dealers.

[deleted]

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#312

Post by 7952 »

meowface wrote: post #266
Estragon wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see why it's such a big deal for law enforcement investigators. They'll still be able to force Apple and Google to send trojan clients to targets, as happened with Hushmail, won't they?

Yes, but it still makes their jobs a lot more difficult. I'm of the opinion that this is not a ruse or scheme, and that law enforcement are genuinely dissatisfied with this. Note that law enforcement and the NSA have a tenuous relationship at best. Even if the NSA still do have privileged access after default mobile encryption is fully rolled out, law enforcement generally will not be able to tap into that except in…

The tech crowd always seem to come to the conclusion that because the powers are over-reaching and bad that they must be unecessary in a partical sense. It is perfectly possible that the surveillance powers really are needed to fight crime. Maybe organised crime and terrorism would increase if all the vulnerabilities that the government use are patched. Technology will undoubtly have a profound impact on crime, and the consequences could be a technical arms race between the public, governments, and criminals. A frightening prospect!

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#313

Post by Shivetya »

Okay, so we know this will be changed, Apple will be forced to allow government the ability to access the information on the phone.

the question I have is, will we be told before this fix is pushed out to phones and can be not update the phone to prevent its installation?

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#314

Post by zo1 »

diminoten wrote: post #154
chaz72 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple has staked their reputation on the line and said "send us an NSL if you like, we have nothing we can give you". And the cryptographic principles, if executed properly, are sound. Maybe they're lying. Maybe Snowden 2.0 will come out next year and tell us the truth and instantly destroy their credibility. That's a gamble I wouldn't take with my company, but it's plausible. See I figure, if you're a threat to Nati…

What makes you think it's such a big gamble? People just don't care about privacy as much as the news would have you believe. Don't believe me? Quick, think of one of the largest and most consistently flagrant private entities who violates the privacy of its users on a regular basis, and is well known for it. Did you say Google? Facebook? Now quickly think of two of the largest companies on the Internet, both in reve…

" Quick, think of one of the largest and most consistently flagrant private entities who violates the privacy of its users on a regular basis, and is well known for it."

And then you go on to claim Facebook and Google as examples of your "violation of privacy". That's like saying my email provider violates my privacy because my email goes through their servers. Or the post-office violates my privacy because my snail mail goes through them. Quite a bit of a stretch, if you ask me.

What people do care about is targeted invasion of privacy, for lack of a better phrase. It's one thing having anonymized data "abused" for targeted advertising and selling as aggregated statistics. But it's completely different if you have an entity that can read your emails at will, and decide to throw you in a cage if you say the wrong thing to the wrong person.

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#315

Post by arh68 »

declan wrote: post #152

I was living in DC during the first Crypto Wars of the late 1990s and covering them as a reporter (I've since shifted to working on recent.io, of course). It sure looks like this will be Crypto Wars II: the Feds Strike Back. From my experience a key question to ask is: What would the eventual law say? Will it make it a federal felony to possess an encrypted phone? Or a federal felony to sell one? The FBI endorsed H.R…

Was this part of the first crypto war? [1,2] I must not have been paying attention.

It's interesting to me that some claim the software didn't work at all:

> Now during all of this Jones and crew simply couldn't get the klutzy software to work.

And none other than Mary Jo was brought in from the home team. Rather strange déjà vu.

[1] http://cryptome.org/dirty-jones.htm [2] http://cryptome.org/dirty-lantern.htm#readers

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#316

Post by lotsofmangos »

dragontamer wrote: post #250
hellbanner wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do you assume the fact will leak out? I thought the FBI disclosed they used parallel construction as an MO.

DEA. Not FBI. Keep your agencies in check. Granted, both are under the Attorney General (formerly Eric Holder)... but Holder's recent MO has been to improve race relations between the Police Agencies and the general public. (See his exceptional handling of Ferguson... but his less-than-exceptional handling of "Fast and Furious")

If Ferguson was exceptionally handled, merely competently handled situations presumably somewhat resemble the plot of Jurassic Park.

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#317

Post by fnordfnordfnord »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #295
Zigurd wrote: post #273

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They could wear suits. That might remind them they are of the people, and their first priority is to serve the people. They might also consider attending the memorial service for Mike Brown. In suits.

They'd have to only attend if off-duty then wouldn't they? One point of police uniform is to identify a person as being a warranted police officer on duty (then there's the appearance of officialdom and the sense of inferiority it breeds in others, the camaraderie, ...). You'd probably need to change the law if you want to allow regular warranted officers to be on duty in civilian clothing, jurisdiction dependent of…

Thank you for making this point. The very last thing we need is to have police disguise themselves as regular folks. It creates a number of dangerous conditions for both the police and the public.

"Who is this random person yelling and waving a gun?" Should I pull over for this random person with flashing lights in their grille?"

It's already bad enough having some traffic enforcement types in unmarked cars or in cars with "ghost" decals.

OTOH, her uniform is very "Aladeen" and while fussing about her uniform is a mostly trivial distraction, having a uniform that is a bit less "Aladeen" would probably short-circuit such criticism. If there weren't more important problems with this person, I would fully support mocking her ridiculous uniform.

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#319

Post by droopybuns »

gnarbarian wrote: post #8

They are going straight into "think of the children mode" " Smartphone communication is “going to be the preferred method of the pedophile and the criminal. We are going to lose a lot of investigative opportunities." Apparently "what about the terrorists?" isn't as effective anymore. Let's hope the public will see through their manipulative talking points.

Remember how iOS 6 stopped all child pornography? What a great operating system.

Re: U.S. Law Enforcement Seeks to Halt Apple-Google Encryption of Mobile Data

#320

Post by fndrplayer13 »

I think this adage puts it best:

You reap what you sow.

If the NSA hadn't so deeply and fundamentally violated our personal privacies in addition to US and International law, I don't think we'd even need to have this conversation. But now we're having it.

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