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Deno Desktop

docs.deno.com

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Re: Deno Desktop

#311

Post by FelipeCortez »

boofus wrote: post #224
preommr wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I will die on the hill that Java was a good language, and had the potential to leapfrog us from where we are by at least a decade. But it got hobbled by the awful, awful enterprise style culture, cultural misunderstanding of OOP (especially inheritance), and corporation shenanigans (fucking oracle).

Java may be good, but it's boring. No joy comes from programming in Java. I need to enjoy my work to be engaged and productive.

You can use Clojure to get all the goodness from Java and still have fun

Re: Deno Desktop

#313

Post by lonelyasacloud »

debazel wrote: post #51
ahartmetz wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's more like developers decided - nobody asked the users.

ironically the only group of users I've found that actually care about native UI, are other developers and Mac purist.

> ironically the only group of users I've found that actually care about native UI, are other developers and Mac purist.

One group of people who routinely carry the can for poor product usability and another who by definition care about the Mac platform; entirely what would be expected.

Re: Deno Desktop

#314

Post by m-schuetz »

skydhash wrote: post #272
m-schuetz wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They may care, however, if they get anything at all. I do not have the resources to target something to all platforms, so the alternative wouldn't be "Users get UI targeted towards their OS", the alternative would be "Users get nothing since developers don't have the time to also target their system".

> I do not have the resources to target something to all platforms What resources is actually needed? More often than not it just requires good engineering. You do not have to duplicate everything across platforms.

Time. I have the time to maintain a single GUI. I do not have the time to maintain three GUIs. Of course they'll be 99% the same, but checking that this 1% difference behaves and looks fine accross systems adds a substantial amount of effort that I simply can not support. And for what exacatly? I want them to be identical accross systems, not different.

Re: Deno Desktop

#315

Post by kodablah »

leleat wrote: post #66

> Shared CEF runtime across apps. Every app currently bundles its own CEF copy. A managed shared runtime would drop binary sizes to a few MB per app. On the roadmap. This[0] sounds interesting. I am not familiar with CEF, so I wonder how the versioning works. When different apps require different versions of CEF, do we just essentially end up with the electron model where every app bundles their own browser (just sli…

I used CEF for a project and Google is detecting CEF via some opaque algorithms and not allowing logins from it. From https://security.googleblog.com/2019/04/better-protection-ag...:

> Because we can’t differentiate between a legitimate sign in and a MITM attack on these platforms, we will be blocking sign-ins from embedded browser frameworks starting in June

Granted this was years ago, maybe the situation improved? I had to abandon my CEF project because of this.

Re: Deno Desktop

#316

Post by yboris »

iagooar wrote: post #159
taosu_la wrote: post #152

Is this a new trend? Why are everyone starting to do desktop runtime? For example, I recently saw Bun Electron, and then I saw this project.

I guess people are tired of each instance of an Electron-based app using 1GB+ of RAM.

Why are people parroting this meme?

For 8 years now, constantly updating to newest Electron, my Electron app has been using only about 150mb of RAM - (see Video Hub App)

Re: Deno Desktop

#317

Post by skydhash »

m-schuetz wrote: post #314
skydhash wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do not have the resources to target something to all platforms What resources is actually needed? More often than not it just requires good engineering. You do not have to duplicate everything across platforms.

Time. I have the time to maintain a single GUI. I do not have the time to maintain three GUIs. Of course they'll be 99% the same, but checking that this 1% difference behaves and looks fine accross systems adds a substantial amount of effort that I simply can not support. And for what exacatly? I want them to be identical accross systems, not different.

> And for what exacatly? I want them to be identical accross systems, not different

For your users. Engineering is about designing things for the convenience of the builder, but for the convenience of the user.

Re: Deno Desktop

#318

Post by duped »

stared wrote: post #167
jorisw wrote: post #3

> Web technology is the most widely-known UI toolkit in the world. Poor choice of words there IMHO. The reason Electron apps get a lot of flak is because they are everything _but_ a UI toolkit. They consistently miss the mark in adopting UI patterns from their host OS. Web tech is just web tech. Yes it will allow you to render a button, but even unstyled, the button won't necessarily look native to the OS, and will v…

Tauri is getting traction in the meantime. A non-native UI has some issues, but also one clear advantage - it is easier to make a cross-system app with the same looks.

Tauri is a good way of packaging offline PWAs. It kind of sucks for building proper applications. The entire model for integrating with a local backend is just bonkers (no, I don't want my local application to pretend to be a web server - it's not a web server, I want to give you actual host bindings and share memory).

Re: Deno Desktop

#319

Post by latexr »

DonHopkins wrote: post #109
vintermann wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not part of the Apple world, but I thought they gave a damn?

Liquid Glass says no, they don't give a flying fuck any more.

Liquid Glass proves they do care (otherwise they wouldn’t have gone to the trouble), they’re just bad at it now.

Re: Deno Desktop

#320

Post by ogoffart »

gf000 wrote: post #55
pjmlp wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it is mostly laziness and cost cutting at the expense of users. Nowadays there isn't even an excuse anymore, just vibe code it away in native frameworks.

Which native framework? Even in a "post-vibe code" era I wouldn't want to create multiple versions of the same app, and none of the "platform-native" GUI toolkits run on everything. SwiftUI is apple-only, gtk has pretty bad compatibility on non-linux, qt is decent but requires C++ or python, and even so still not much for mobile. Don't even get started on "Windows frameworks", because as I write this sentence they ma…

one missing from that list: Slint, which i work on. runs on Linux, Windows, macOS and embedded, with app logic in Rust, C++, Python or JS.

You can use JS but it doesn't ship a browser engine, it renders with its own lightweight toolkit.

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