I remember at Google at around 2007 - 2009, as Google was massively expanding its data centers, there was a lot of unused capacity, especially during off-hours. Any engineer could run as many jobs as they wanted at zero priority, which means the job would be first in line to be killed if a more important task needed the resource. I did so many interesting experiments with MapReduces that would run overnight. For a wh…
Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
311–320 of 360 posts
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#312Why nobody talks about those points, which are actually the only interesting points of all this AI craze?
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#313Earlier quoted context omitted.
The argument in favor of "tokenmaxxing" has always been that it's creating space for employees to freely explore the broad and novel space of AI-enabled workflows. I've seen a number of use cases where I'm skeptical any value is being produced, but a number of others where some team or another has finally solved a long-standing problem of theirs with an agentic workflow that would have been hard to justify to a cost…
+1 I find the general disdain for C-suite or senior engineering leadership on HN so silly. These people didn't get promoted or hired because of nepotism. A lot of them moved up the engineering ladder and are familiar with how software engineering works and the incentives involved. Yes, some of them are sheep and will blindly copy what is fashionable but so do a large swath of ICs. If you want incredibly fast adoption…
Good one!
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#314Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is so cool, I have my own fan on HN that cherry picks my comment history to call me a shill!
You could have easily disproved my claim by linking your comments with a more balanced or nuanced opinions on the matter, except you cannot, because there is only even more outlandish and wild stuff you say about AI and LLMs.
And now you’re asking them to somehow disprove they aren’t a shill? How would that even work. You seem unnecessarily antagonistic towards that user
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#315They are burning money to pay for AI-assisted development. Ok. But what is the ROI of it all? Was it worth the supposed increase on efficiency? Why nobody talks about those points, which are actually the only interesting points of all this AI craze?
I can output 5 useless/bad features in a day with Claude or I can output 1 useful feature per 2 day period. Which one has better impact on ROI?
In this example, it might seem like it's an easy answer. But, in the real world, it is a lot more nuanced and much more difficult to measure and so not many are bothering to do it and are opting in for the simple solution of following the hype.
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#316Earlier quoted context omitted.
That is interesting but tokenmaxxing is not maximizing token usage _efficiency_. It is maximizing its usage.
Thanks, that's so odd that I assumed it was about efficiency, which is how I treat tokens. It's hard to imagine a 19th century business man ordering his staff to send as many long winded telegrams as they can.
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#317I remember at Google at around 2007 - 2009, as Google was massively expanding its data centers, there was a lot of unused capacity, especially during off-hours. Any engineer could run as many jobs as they wanted at zero priority, which means the job would be first in line to be killed if a more important task needed the resource. I did so many interesting experiments with MapReduces that would run overnight. For a wh…
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#318I actually do think token maxing is good, but they should have limited it per user. I find it reallly hard to get people to max out the Claude $100 plan, let alone the $200 plan. I understand the enterprise plans are different and more expensive, which is how you get these kinds of issues. But encouraging people to try things with AI is very important, and some amount of token maxing is importsnt.
It's like paying drivers per gallon of fuel consumed and then acting all surprised that you see them revving their engine while waiting at a red light.
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#319Earlier quoted context omitted.
You could have easily disproved my claim by linking your comments with a more balanced or nuanced opinions on the matter, except you cannot, because there is only even more outlandish and wild stuff you say about AI and LLMs.
It‘s perfectly ok to share opinions that aren’t nuanced or balanced. You seem to have something strongly against that specific user, the fact that you felt the need to go through so much of their history, post a massive list of their „suspicious“ comments, and mention in multiple places how they are a shill is pretty concerning imho and doesn’t make you look good at all. Their activity looks fine, they seem to be ent…
I did not have to go through "so much of their history", this is just the last 9 days. There are considerably wilder claims from them earlier, when the account was solely focused on propping up LLM-hype and defending Anthropic.
We are living through a period of time with one of the potentially most disruptive technologies ever being developed. A lot (A LOT) of money is invested into it, a lot of livelihoods are and might be affected by it, and some people stand to gain A LOT from it. So there are significant interests to sway public opinion in favour of LLMs and AI, to hype it up to unreasonable extent, to muddle the waters of a reasonable discourse. Accounts such as solenoid0937 are unleashed on public forums to achieve that, and because of that we have to take everything they write with a huge grain of salt, or even ignore completely, as there is just no true information in their comments.
You yourself got baited by them by considering what they wrote seriously regarding "amazing things with unlimited tokens". Now the idea that "LLMs 1) are used in one of FAANGs massively and 2) are used to produce amazing things" is planted. Will you remember later that they did not actually provide any evidence of that? The account has been doing this trick multiple times over the last few weeks.
For me, as someone who is actually using LLMs in their work, a single balanced comment on the matter would have been more than enough to consider them not being a shill. Unfortunately, instead they have claimed recently that they went completely full-on with agentic coding (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48245721) skipping reviews and pushing to prod directly (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48243651) at a FAANG, no less. And they claimed it in such a manner that this is objectively the only proper way to do the work, and all other approaches are doomed. How is this anything else than peddling unfounded LLM-hype, I do not know.
The example above might seem like a singular episode, but they have been doing it over and over for the last year and a half, so this is now a pattern. No actual evidence for any of their claims is provided, so the only thing left is AI-hype, and pretty wild at that. So why would a reasonable person, with ostensibly enough money to retire (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48252297), ostensibly working at a FAANG, spend all their days spreading unfounded AI-hype in a degrading manner on HN and defending Anthropic? Given the vested financial interest in the technology, the most plausible answer here is that they are paid to do so.
Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing
#320Earlier quoted context omitted.
Most of the codebase is custom integrations for local markets. You can systematize some of it but most of the complexity comes from there.
Can you provide an example? What is different about running Uber services in Chicago vs. Indianapolis?
Every different country Uber operates in is a moving legal and regulatory target